Radiator mounting opinions wanted

[Jeff]

Ok here are some photos of where I am at. My radiator is about 2 inches too high to make the body cowl line match the grill shell. this is right even the bottom of the frame mounting. I like the pump position as I could run a conventional fan. It it about 1 inch off center. I have to drop the mounting about 2 inches and go to an electric fan to make the cowl and grill lines match up. I am going to post the following pics. I would like your opinions as to which way you all think I should go at this piont. the radiator mounting is about the last thing I need to get worked out. before finish welding and painting the frame.

 

[Jeff]

Ok here are some photos of where I am at. My radiator is about 2 inches too high to make the body cowl line match the grill shell. this is right even the bottom of the frame mounting. I like the pump position as I could run a conventional fan. It it about 1 inch off center. I have to drop the mounting about 2 inches and go to an electric fan to make the cowl and grill lines match up. I am going to post the following pics. I would like your opinions as to which way you all think I should go at this piont. the radiator mounting is about the last thing I need to get worked out. before finish welding and painting the frame.

 

[EX JUNK]

My question would be, why not drop the radiator the needed 2". That 2" below the frame should not cause any problems from what I can see from the pictures. It also looks as though the '32 grill shell has to be dropped anyhow to hide the gap that you have to the top of the frame rail. Also, I think that you have enough room to mount a conventional fan from what I can see in the pictures. My fan is a 15 1/2" stock fan and I have no clearance or overheating problems.

Jim

 

[one finger john]

This looks like another case of gotta get it outside to see how everything lines up. Also, I would use tape to create a "hood" to see the real lines. With all the different lines (engine angle, carb angle, body in relation to frame/to the ground, bed angle in relation to body/frame/ ground) it's tough to "see" the relationships in a small garage. Rad shell looks high.
Other than that.........

John

 

[Indycars]

Looks like there is going to be a big gap at the top of the fan to radiator distance
when compared to the same distance at the bottom of the fan. Looks to me like
something needs to change to make that relationship more parallel.

If you go with a electric fan this would be a moot point.

 

[2old2fast]

You're gonna have to lower the rad. & shell , if you have to have a mech fan , then you're gonna have to lower the engine , an electric fan sounds pretty good , Huh??
dave

 

[one finger john]

All righty now........ I have my flame suit on and everything is sealed up. So youse guys can bang on me all you want.
When I was putting cars together (long time ago), all my alignments were always made to run as parallel to to each other and to the ground as possible. This meant no elevated-in-the front engines. No seemingly out of alignment radius rods running at odd angles. Steering rods, again running at angles from the box to the arm. With the advent of the "Fad" T all that changed (I think). Angles every which a way. I really wish a good chassis man would chime in and set me straight. Kinda wish Ted Brown was still around. Jim, maybe you can explain where I'm going wrong here.
As for the OP Jeff, in no way am I knocking your build or fabrication expertise. I "see" one thing and then to correct it something else must be changed. I am frustrated at my inability to "see" why the original concept was not followed thru. Maybe that is the process that must be followed. Cut and fit. Cut and try to fit.

Sorry for the highjacking. Maybe it is "keep your mouth closed and your (my) eyes open".

John

 

[Jeff]

Thanks for all the input. I kind of thought the consensus would be to lower the rad but just wanted your opinions on it. The core is 17 inches tall and would be about 1 inch off center once a two inch fan spacer is added. So dropping it only leaves electric option. The engine is set to leave the carbs at 0 degrees when on the ground. My garage floor is way out of level giving things a bad appearance unless. I used a level and metal on the floor to get level to set the rake etc. Ya I kind of wish Ted could pay me a visit and lend some pointers and engineering to this. heck I would have been done by now and on to a second one probably. Fabricating the drop is the next obstacle, not sure how best to do it. thought about taking 2 x 3 tubing and cutting out the section where the radiator sits, maybe add a piece of channel 1 inch thick to the bottom to add strength back to it. Thanks to all for your input.

 

[one finger john]

O.K., better now. The cars I used to work on were Model As and the different location points (suspension, engine, body) were pretty much predetermined.
If I may ask, Jeff. Do you have a central point, what I would call a "constant", from where all measurements originate? That predetermined point from which all other measurements originate. So that you know that the frame is square, rear axle is properly aligned and positioned, engine / transmission mounts are aligned in the frame itself (spatially and in relation to the rear axle [including off set in degrees], etc. ?

Now I'm sleepy and 0400 comes early. Thanks for listening to me.

John

 

[Hot Rod Todd]

So how did you get on lowering your radiator?

If its still in the "thinking bout how to do it stage" I can go to my workshop and do some measurements on my set up. Mine is a strap of steel that the radiator sits on, which sits below the lower chassis rail. When we needed a taller radiator (was cooling a blown 454) we got a longer core and lowered the strap so the top of the radiator stayed in the same place.

Theres nothing as funky as a too tall radiator in a bucket

 

[cooter]

i can tell you that i set all my radiator with frame level on jack stands... that was a mistake... always build at ride height.. when i set car on wheels my frame rake made the radiator lean forward and now my radiator needs to come up bout 2 inches... just my observation... glad i tack welded and rolled it outside...

 

[cooter]

see what i mean?

 

[Zandoz]

A while back on Dave Kindig's Velocity TV show, they were correcting the problems on a 32 roadster build. Part of the corrections was to change the radiator and shell from vertical to leaning forward just like yours. One man's correction is another's corruption <shrug>

 

[tfeverfred]

A while back on Dave Kindig's Velocity TV show, they were correcting the problems on a 32 roadster build. Part of the corrections was to change the radiator and shell from vertical to leaning forward just like yours. One man's correction is another's corruption <shrug>

Yup. I'd let the radiator and shell fall in line with the body and cowl line. If you look at a side view of my old bucket, it looks like it was snapped in half at the firewall. That illusion comes from 2 different lines, separate of each other. The first line is from the grill shell to the cowl. The second is from the cowl back. I always hated it but was too lazy to change it. On my new build, the shell will follow the same line as the body and with a nice subtle rake, all will be good.

Here's an example. Remember, depending on your age, when guys were jacking up the rear of their cars to get a "rake"? Well, when they did, they didn't try to make the hood and grill stay level. Why? Because it would have been hard to do and it would have looked like crap.

And Jeff, without hi-jacking your thread, what is the length of your front spring? I'm looking at lengths for my car and trying to get an idea or two.

 

[fletcherson]

see what i mean?

I think it looks fine, matches the cowl and firewall line, but your opinion is the one that counts.

 

[choppedtop]

I agree with fletch on this one, on both statements. I always like the shell a bit lower than is the cowl. Although, when I see the Graffiti Coupe, I wonder WTF. I have heard it was originally was suppose to be a channeled body. That would explain it.

 

[cooter]

i leaned it back so it is vertical. i did not raise it up any. i dont wanna hack jeffs thread.

 

[tfeverfred]

Looks much better.

 

[tfeverfred]

Any updates on this build?