baby Olds

[Gerry]

Moved this away as it was off subject to Northstar.

Where do I start. Our 3.5 ltr V8 Rover is the most used engine in hot rods in the UK. It was certainly the staple for Anglia s, 32s and Ts in the 70, 80 and 90s. Why? because they were plentiful, not TOO big, light, and cheap. American V8s were harder to find and in a lot of peoples mind, did not have a power advantage when off set with the extra weight.
I know that my buddy who was running a SBF and cracked the block on a cold night (no antifreeze Huh!) replaced it with a Rover and said it was faster.
Rover engine are now very rare and well sough after and a whole aftermarket has sprung up around then The now offer the old 3500cc Rover up to 5200cc. in various stages of ever increasing capacity.

When John and i were playing around a lot more with cars for ourselves and other we had around 15 of these engines sitting in the shed all waiting for a home. Everyone of them needed hydraulic followers replaced and camshaft bearings done, it was their weak spot. At that time each follower was £4.00 (probably close to $7.50 at that time) so a full set of 16 meant a sizable investment.
I will try and fish out a few pics of cars with them in.

Yep they did a EFI version in the standard car... very rare and the of course the Turbo beast.

The Audi engines are a FORTUNE even from a breakers and with the modern CanBus system I think you would need to be a electronics wizard to get the engine to run in something else. Even the instrument panel in the Audi had inputs and outputs to the Engine mapping, not to mention the AC, ABS, EPS, Audio system, headligh adjusters etc etc. But it is a monster with torque to die for.

Gerry

 

[deckofficer]

Gerry,

Your comment on Audi engines, were you referring to the 4.2 L diesel V8? I remember years ago our little 215 cid Turbo-Fire V8 with turbo and water injection. Is this engine the template for the Rover engine?

Bob

 

[Northstar T]

Gerry,

Your comment on Audi engines, were you referring to the 4.2 L diesel V8? I remember years ago our little 215 cid Turbo-Fire V8 with turbo and water injection. Is this engine the template for the Rover engine?

Bob

A brief history: Buick made the all aluminum 215 CI V-8 from 61 to 63. Pontiac used the Buick engine in it's Tempest models, and Olds used the same engine but with it's own cylinder head design that used 6 bolts per cylinder instead of 5, as they had planned for the higher compression and turbo early on. the 63 Buick four barrel motor (which I have) had 11:1 compression for 200 HP. There were several "firsts" in these engines. first production all aluminum engine. first turbocharged production engine in the US. perhaps the first production based engine to win a Formula 1 race (Repco Brabham) . etc, etc. It was a great little motor. GM had a lot of reject blocks due to porosity in the aluminum castings during production years, so they threw in the towel after the 63 model year, and by 66 or so the engine tooling was sold to Rover. Rover did some changes to the casting process and used the engine for decades after that with great success. GM wanted to buy it back in the 70s "gas shortage" years, but Rover declined (although they did offer to sell GM as many engines as they wanted ).
I'm sure Gerry knows way more than I do about the changes made during the Rover years, so I'll leave that history lesson up to him, but here in the US, the BOP version was, and still is, a very popular swap into Vegas and MGs as well as many street rods, sand rails, experimental aircraft, and who knows what else. I'll see if I can dig up a pic of it in Formula one attire, as that one is pretty cool. it also has several Weber manifold designs available for it which would look wicked in a bucket for example. At 320 lb fully dressed it's go the power to weight thing pretty well in hand.
PS: I did find a pic of the Repco/Brabham modified version as used in Formula one racing in 68 or so (see attached)

Russ

 

[Northstar T]

one of these would look good on a stockish 215 in a T. also available straight up if you don't care for the cross ram style.

 

[409T]

I've never tried 11:1 on pump gas (California pump gas) and I don't know if Oregon has better stuff. Think the compression ratio will be a problem?

Jeff

 

[Northstar T]

I've never tried 11:1 on pump gas (California pump gas) and I don't know if Oregon has better stuff. Think the compression ratio will be a problem?

Jeff

Strangely, no. Aluminum heads are good for at least an extra point of compression without detonation, but even so..... many 215 owners swear they not only have no detonation problems with this engine, but many use mid grade fuel or even regular (in winter) without problems. I'll let you know in a few months when it gets installed in our "A"

Russ

 

[deckofficer]

A brief history: Buick made the all aluminum 215 CI V-8 from 61 to 63. Pontiac used the Buick engine in it's Tempest models, and Olds used the same engine but with it's own cylinder head design that used 6 bolts per cylinder instead of 5, as they had planned for the higher compression and turbo early on. the 63 Buick four barrel motor (which I have) had 11:1 compression for 200 HP. There were several "firsts" in these engines. first production all aluminum engine. first turbocharged production engine in the US. perhaps the first production based engine to win a Formula 1 race (Repco Brabham) . etc, etc. It was a great little motor. GM had a lot of reject blocks due to porosity in the aluminum castings during production years, so they threw in the towel after the 63 model year, and by 66 or so the engine tooling was sold to Rover. Rover did some changes to the casting process and used the engine for decades after that with great success. GM wanted to buy it back in the 70s "gas shortage" years, but Rover declined (although they did offer to sell GM as many engines as they wanted ).
I'm sure Gerry knows way more than I do about the changes made during the Rover years, so I'll leave that history lesson up to him, but here in the US, the BOP version was, and still is, a very popular swap into Vegas and MGs as well as many street rods, sand rails, experimental aircraft, and who knows what else. I'll see if I can dig up a pic of it in Formula one attire, as that one is pretty cool. it also has several Weber manifold designs available for it which would look wicked in a bucket for example. At 320 lb fully dressed it's go the power to weight thing pretty well in hand.
PS: I did find a pic of the Repco/Brabham modified version as used in Formula one racing in 68 or so (see attached)

Russ

Russ,
That motor is a visual work of art. At 320 lbs, you can't help but want one for any high power to weight ratio ride. Do you know what the engine ratings were for the Formula 1 application?

 

[Northstar T]

Russ,
That motor is a visual work of art. At 320 lbs, you can't help but want one for any high power to weight ratio ride. Do you know what the engine ratings were for the Formula 1 application?

The F1 motor actually wasn't as hot as some of the Euro motors of the day, but what it lacked in power it made up in weight savings and torque. I've heard the max power for the 600 series (SOHC 16 valve) was something like 320 HP at ~7500 RPM but with "very high" torque from 3500 to 7000. redline around 8000.
I've heard varing numbers produced, but it sounds like around 35 were built, so not likey to find one of those in the bone yard

Russ

 

[Ted Brown]

With the exhaust system in the top center of the engine, it is possible to have the perfect header system for a none blown engine... short 8 into 1 and fully in the firing order into a stinger, best you can have, plus they look GREAT for sure...

 

[409T]

I think you should tear it down and polish the block and heads. Just don't ask me to help.

Jeff

 

[Northstar T]

I think you should tear it down and polish the block and heads. Just don't ask me to help.

Jeff

yup. wouldn't that be puuuurdy??

hey Gerry. where's those pictures you were gona post of UK rods with Rover/baby Olds/Buick motors.

Russ

 

[Gerry]

yup. wouldn't that be puuuurdy??

hey Gerry. where's those pictures you were gona post of UK rods with Rover/baby Olds/Buick motors.

Russ

here a couple to start with.

Dont ask me for more pics as these are the only ones I have. It IS a Genuine USA 215ci engine and was hand polished back int the 70s. It in a T (bet you did nt figure that one out) that stormed the shows and magazine way back then.
I will have to search my old photos for more pics. Some may not be in Ts so shout if you disapprove.
Gerry

 

[GT63]

With the exhaust system in the top center of the engine, it is possible to have the perfect header system for a none blown engine... short 8 into 1 and fully in the firing order into a stinger, best you can have, plus they look GREAT for sure...

Like this?

 

[Ted Brown]

Would have liked to see the business end (talking end) of them thar headers... hehe

 

[Ted Brown]

PS, I myself like less polish and more flat stock paint, to show off a bit of polish here and there... Not everything is beautiful... just the lines that make the car look better...

 

[Gerry]

Ooops. Too much shine for Ted but heres a couple more Rover Ts


Gerry

 

[Northstar T]

No coment on the first one, but the blue one is very nice indeed (except for the $2.00 mirrors). Love the injection!

Russ

 

[Gerry]

No coment on the first one, but the blue one is very nice indeed (except for the $2.00 mirrors). Love the injection!

Russ

I think the first one is a VERY early UK Bucket going back to the 60s or 70s.
Whats wrong with the mirrors??? I have 2 brass one in boxes ready to go on mine. The guy that owns the blue one is a real Bucket dude. He loves his ride and everything T shaped. Had a chat with him at the Nats this year and he was good to talk to. I did tell him about the forum.
G

 

[Gerry]

Hey guys
This is sort of off topic but it may interest some of you.

One of my previous (honest officer it was only a minor offense) WAS A 'KIT CAR'. Called Nova in the UK, I think it was a Sebring in the US. Originally with an air cooler VW... I looked at more power and decided that the cost was so High I may as well put a baby V8 in it using the Rover (Buick) lump. We had to cut the whole of the back of the body off and reform it once the motor was in. Also install rads etc etc. Loads of work but it seemed to do the trick when faced with the rice rocket of the times. Had an offy inlet manifold, cam and a 4 Barrel Holly, which put me off them for life. A few other bits so it was pushing190-210 BHP... a lot for the day in such a light car. It used to hit the cats eyes (things in the middle of the road with reflectors in them) at 90 plus due to the down force and low ride height. Also would go sidewayS with a 4 - 3 change down and a heavy right foot. FUN FUN FUN.

Sold it to a guy who changed his bank to get a loan. Said he had pics from the magazine all over his room. I was happy, he was happy so said goodbye to my little V8 sports car. It was only 31'' to the roof, which means I could not get in to it now.


gerry

PS Buckets are prettier and more fun

 

[Ted Brown]

I remember those for sure, only a couple were built near me, saw a Black one with a SBC, sounded good... Gerry your's looked fine also, probably road like a buck wagon being so low.. hehe