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Headlight hi, lo relay

F

fletcherson

Well-Known Member
I want to utilize a momentary switch to flash the high beams on and off so I can avoid having to deal with a dimmer switch in my limited floor space. I know there are spdt, latching relays available to do this, and they were used on 67-79 vw Beatles and others. I have found mixed reviews, most claim they are not heavy enough for modern lights. I can deal with that issue with a seperate relay, no problem. I just wondered if anyone has any wisdom here or a source for a quality part.
 
Ron Francis Synergy headlight switches are available with a built-in dimmer
switch in a 3-position pull knob or with dome lights, headlights, running lights,
and a dimmer for the dash with a built-in circuit breaker for the headlights.

I bought the RF switch, so that there would only be one switch to do everything,
thus taking up less room. They are abit expensive at $40 thou.

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/rfw-hl16

HeadlightSwithc_RFW-HL16_ml.jpg
 
You need to be aware of the stem length and the dash thickness. By stem length, I mean the threaded shaft that protrudes through the dash for the retaining nut. My dash is 1/4 inch alum plate and it did require some special work.
 
Very true, it's not that long of a threaded shaft. Mine is in the console and
the plate is 3/16 inch thick, so no problem for me, but just barely.
 
Cool, thanks for the replies! I actually looked at some of the Ron France's stuff, but must have overlooked this switch. Is the shaft threaded so I can use knobs that match the ones I am using on my column, etc? I will look it up later, just wonder.
 
If you run LED headlights, you could run 1 switch, then when you flip to highbeams, the current draw from these jewels is so small, you could work things out easily....with a really small switch and relay....just a thought.
 
fletcherson said:
Is the shaft threaded so I can use knobs that match the ones I am using on my column,
Click to expand...

Yes it's threaded for about 1/4 inch. If you are referring to the knob you pull
on when turning lights on and off, then that has a set screw to hold it on.

HeadlightSwithc_RFW-HL16_Lg.jpg

RonFrancisHeadlightSwitch.jpg
 
Thanks for the info. I looked at his site,(not trying to turn this into an advertisement) and he also offers the electric relay kit to do what I want (more than I want to spend for a relay).The thing I really like that he has are turn signal and tilt levers that have momentary switches incorporated in them. I already bought some that I like better than his design, but may opt to return them and order his just for that feature to keep everything on the column except for a switch or two on the dash. Cool stuff, but pricey. Hard to complain when there aren't many offerings to choose from. I did find a simple, inexpensive resolve to the relay issue from rock auto, of all places. And it's a common relay used on headlights and sunroofs and is available through most auto parts stores if I need a replacement. If anyone has an interest, let me know and I will post the part number. I want to retain my original idea of the momentary switch to keep the controls at my finger tips. Now to find or design a cool line lock button for my shifter handle, not for burnouts, to hold it at lights on hills. I am using a different handle on my shifter than the hurst, so the ole trusty round ball with button won't work, at least not without modification.... I cruise around in the hocking hills area, and sometimes holding the brakes and feathering the clutch gets tiresome. Sucks to get old, lol! Nice to see screaming metal back in circulation! Thanks Indy for your info! Ps, I was able to procure all of the parts to put drum brakes back on the rear end for about $125.00, thanks to rock auto and their close out deals. Not so lucky on the fronts, I ordered parts last nite and am at about a grand, but had to order spindles and steering arms too, and chrome, since the front ent is all chrome.... Ouch! Lol.
 
If you are looking to save some room, might consider a relay
module. It only takes one ground wire for all four relays on a
single module.

You will have to PM me for the purchasing link. Posting the
link does not work.
$30
RelayModule.JPG
RelayModule01.jpg
FP14_HaveWires_6065.jpg
 
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I found a company that makes all kind of knobs, including shifter knobs in America, no less, and they offer custom size and thread options. I was able to order one that is aluminum, threaded correctly and recessed for my shifter arm with a momentary switch for the line lock. They are called "twisted shifters" if interested.
 
Hey Fletch, not sure what you're looking for, a button or a relay or how to wire it. Here's how I'd wire it:
hi%252520lo.jpg

The momentary button controls the relay which turns on the high beam. If you need a relay and socket, eBay has them for $5. Can't seem to post a link, but just search 12v relay.
 
PotvinGuy said:
Hey Fletch, not sure what you're looking for, a button or a relay or how to wire it. Here's how I'd wire it:
hi%252520lo.jpg

The momentary button controls the relay which turns on the high beam. If you need a relay and socket, eBay has them for $5. Can't seem to post a link, but just search 12v relay.
Click to expand...
Thanks! I have it worked out. My only dilemma was that I wanted to use a momentary spst switch such as a line lock, nitrous, or cruis control button to engage the hi relay to keep the controls at my finger tips because I have no room on the floor due to the clutch pedal, so the simplest way was with a latching relay, otherwise it would only stay hi if the button was held. That wasn't hard to find, only finding one that would withstand the draw of the lights... I could find them rated up to 20 amps, or had to step up to a very pricey latching rely, overkill. I could have built a module with some relays, diode, etc, but seemed less simple than need be. I solved it with additional relays. Pretty much as you sketched, only added additional hi amp relays triggered by the latching relay. I just wondered if someone had a magic bean I missed out on, lol!
 
fletcherson said:
I want to utilize a momentary switch to flash the high beams on and off so I can avoid having to deal with a dimmer switch in my limited floor space. I know there are spdt, latching relays available to do this, and they were used on 67-79 vw Beatles and others. I have found mixed reviews, most claim they are not heavy enough for modern lights. I can deal with that issue with a seperate relay, no problem. I just wondered if anyone has any wisdom here or a source for a quality part.
Click to expand...

Fletcherson, I wired my headlights on 2 switches no relay, no dimmer. Seems to work fine so far, 1 switch for headlights, 1 switch for hi-beams.
 
Fletch,
I think you have the wrong idea of a latching relay, a regular relay is on as long as it has power and ground.
A latch relay can use power or ground to flip the contacts from one side to the other.
Normally used it has ground all the time, and power is applied on one side to flip the contacts and when the logic is reversed the power is applied to the other side of the relay to flip the contacts to the other side.
No need for expensive relays, or any at all if your switches can handle the current.
 
I have decided to give out my plans.
You can download the zip file here of my pdf files.
This is an aircraft style breaker panel that I will be mounting beside the battery in the rear box, however you can substitute the for your regular old glass fuses it you want.
Also I should mention this is an example .. these drawings are unsigned and I am in no way responsible for anything. ( Someone said Americans like to sue for anything ..lol)
http://www.jeffw.ca/Bucket/Electrical/Electrical.zip
I have left out the circuit for Nitro Arm and Nitro Purge, as well as the security circuit.
The light switch circuit shows 2 relays and 2 switches, but that can be combined in to one switch as shown above or just 2 switches without the relays.
 
Intrepid said:
Fletch,
I think you have the wrong idea of a latching relay, a regular relay is on as long as it has power and ground.
A latch relay can use power or ground to flip the contacts from one side to the other.
Normally used it has ground all the time, and power is applied on one side to flip the contacts and when the logic is reversed the power is applied to the other side of the relay to flip the contacts to the other side.
No need for expensive relays, or any at all if your switches can handle the current.
Click to expand...
Yea, I understand. The whole reason I am using one is to be able to toggle from hi to lo beam by closing a normally open momentary switch to the ground of the latching relay, it will then power the light relays. I will be able to toggle from hi to lo beam by simply closing the momentary switch, which is very small, and rated for very low amperage. The reason for this seeming over engineered design is that I have no room for a traditional dimmer switch, and I do not want any switches on the dash,,etc... So I am using a very discrete momentary NOSP that will be mounted in the shifter. Several manufacturers used this relay system to control the hi lo function, including Volkswagen, so I am not taking any credit, just stealing their idea.
 
Ok.. that will work fine if you are set on a momentary switch.
But it sounds like all you need is a small push button switch that is on/on/off with regular old relays.
 
Intrepid said:
Ok.. that will work fine if you are set on a momentary switch.
But it sounds like all you need is a small push button switch that is on/on/off with regular old relays.
Click to expand...
I know, functionally, you are right, but that would be too easy, lol. I want to keep all of the controls at a very user friendly ergonomic, lol, fashion... You would have to understand the extreme effort I've exerted to make this thing comfortable to drive to understand my mind set... I decided to mount the switch either on the turn or tilt knob, or the shifter so it will be easy to reach without reaching for the dash or under the seat, so while driving, I can keep my hands on the controls and still access the dimmer. I could have also mounted one on the steering wheel, but I couldn't find the carbon contacts that would work with my column to do so and I dont want external wires or cords. It's a standard shift, so there is no room on the floor for a normal dimmer switch anywhere close to a useable location. It seems like a small detail, but I live in the country and most of the shows that I attend are in the evenings, so I do a considerable amount of night driving on secondary hilly roads, so I want good lights and fingertip controls and I couldn't find any normal spst switches that were small enough to work in any of the locations and looked right. I almost went with a micro toggle, and it would have worked, but I really wanted a momentary to simplify being able to flash, or select hi or lo beam. It was either a cruise control type momentary, or a line lock/nitrous type and I am already using one of those for a line lock. I did locate a really cool small momentary that is designed for use in motorcycle handlebars as a starter button with a relay, and was able to fit it in the sleeve that replaces the reverse lockout lever on the Muncie shifter I am using from a vette. Problem solved with no bulky switch. There are some cool switches available from Ron white that mount on the column levers, but I already have specific levers and knobs and his design doesn't come close to matching. If I would have seen his first, I may have went that route, but already have the ones I am using.
 
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