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Looking for some input

Mike

Well-Known Member
I'm just thinking out loud, here, so bear with me for a few minutes. But I am hoping to hear your thoughts and opinions, so don't be shy about letting me know what you think.

Now that it appears the good shop XenForo is righted and sailing toward the future, I am willing to continue looking at ways of adding more features and functions to this site. When we left vBulletin (wow, that was back in the Fall of '09), we lost a script I really enjoyed using - GARS, which was short for the Geek Article and Review System. We used GARS to drive our tech articles and it worked quite well for us. When I made the biggest mistake of my life (OK, maybe that 2nd marriage was bigger :rolleyes:) and converted the site over to Invision Power Board, I used IP.Content to power the articles.

We were an early adopter of the current XenForo software, which meant there were not many add-on scripts available. And shortly after we got up and running on XenForo, the silly Internet Brands lawsuit against XenForo was filed, so everything came to an abrupt, screeching halt.

But now, it looks like it is safe to start looking to the future again, so I am wondering about an official XenForo add-on, to drive an articles library. But I have some real questions and so I thought I would invite each one of you into this decision-making process.

First off - We converted to XenForo, back on 25 November 2011. Since that time, we've added over 500 members and nearly 20,000 posts, so it is not as if the site has been dying on the vine without a separate articles library script. So I am not sure this is something you are interested in, or would even use.

Second - We've recently had some pretty thin months, with respect to the site donations. Have we reached a saturation point, where interest is now (or already has) peaked and are we starting to experience a decline in activity?

traffic001.jpg


Here is a graph, representing our traffic, since January 2011, through the end of March 2013. The red line is an approximation of when XenForo was installed. There was a slight drop in traffic a couple months later, which was February 2012. We always see a sag in February's traffic numbers, because we are dealing with a short month. There was a another sag in June and an outright drastic drop in November. But, as you can see, we recovered from the drop in December 2012 and with the exception of February, we're zooming right along. Actually, since November 2011, our traffic has just a little better than doubled, so I don't think we've peaked out.

I was concerned about the conversion to XenForo, as we were not going to have a photo gallery any longer. The IP.Gallery script was pretty popular and I worried that the loss of the Gallery might have a negative effect on site traffic. But that doesn't seem to have had an adverse effect, same as the loss of a tech article library seemed to have no real effect. So, as is common when trying to second-guess the target audience, I'm confused.

What do you think?

Let me show you an example of what the article add-on would look like. A pal of mine has just opened a brand-new, invitation-only XenForo Admin forum and she is using the Resource Manager on the site.

rm001.jpg


The Resource Manager offers the initial resource in a separate area, but keeps discussion for each resource in the forums, with easy-to-use links to get back and forth between the two.

rm002.jpg


Here is the actual Resource Manager page. The Manager is actually very flexible, as it can be used as a place to download actual computer files, as well as holding tutorials. Since we would have no need for that download capability (at least that I can foresee), that would be a feature we would likely never use.

rm003.jpg


I don't expect the tutorial to mean anything to any of you, but you can see where Lisa has come up with a template modification for XenForo. And she is sharing it here, complete with the code snippet and images to help explain how the modification works. But there is a button, right above the tutorial, that allows a user to zip from this page, directly over to the discussion forum.

rm004.jpg


Here is a look at her Resources forum category, with the various forums listed.

rm005.jpg


And there is her Template Changes forum, with the topic showing.

rm006.jpg


The Manager displays a snippet of the tutorial in the forum view, with links to zip back to the Manager to read the full tutorial, or there is a reply panel there, had I wanted to comment on her modification.

The site can be partially viewed at xenadmins.com, but since membership on the site is by invitation only, what you will see is limited and there are no registration links. I think the above screenshots give you a pretty clear look at what the Resource Manager offers.

Talk to me, tell me your thoughts. Do we need this thing? Would installing it bring additional value to the forum experience?

The license is a $60 expense and annual renewals are $15. The amounts seem rather insignificant, but when we are regularly operating in the red, they cannot be ignored.

I am keeping my ear to the ground on a photo gallery add-on, as well. As soon as there is something to show you, I will likely be looking for your input on that, as well.

Resource Manager? Good? Bad? Indifferent?

Photo Gallery? Same questions.

What is something you would like to see added to the site that we do not already offer? Let the discussion begin...
 
I would prefer a photo gallery. I "think" you can find most tech stuff by searching the forum. Sometimes I would like to able to save a post so I can retrieve it for later use.
 
Mike I think this site is great the way it is but if you just want to spend more money the photo gallery would be used more by me...........
 
Mike,
I personally would like to see this site grow to it's full potential. This site has helped myself and others more then any of the other wannabe sites or manuals ever could! I can see where the concern of costs would make you wonder since the last couple of months the donations have dropped off from members (myself included), yet the membership continues to grow. The site carries value or the new membership would be dropping off instead of growing. The site speed and features have also been improved with changes you have brought forward for member discussion. I have full faith that you will make the best decision based on your research and dedication to this site. As I've stated in the past, I'd still like to see a structured means of membership dues and or donations to keep the site open, maintained and improving. Maybe a members only area or options that are only available to supporting members. My thought here is to only encourage a financially sound site and not alienate anyone. Thank you for keeping this site the best source of T-Bucket information on the web.
 
Would it be possible to add the library / photo gallery and make them supporting member access only? That would give people a little more encouragement to become supporting members.
 
Why drive a new Caddy on a used Fords pocket book..I know your donor policy..But if we don't find a way to fund this site I'm sure it will be gone..
 
I agree with jim, a structured means of membership would work. Say 10$ to join and 5$ a month. I don't know if that would do it but with the amount of knowledge that I have gotten from here that's priceless.
 
Would it be possible to add the library / photo gallery and make them supporting member access only? That would give people a little more encouragement to become supporting members.
Aye, and quite easily accomplished. That is something I had also been considering.

I agree with jim, a structured means of membership would work. Say 10$ to join and 5$ a month. I don't know if that would do it but with the amount of knowledge that I have gotten from here that's priceless.
Mike, it sounds really easy in theory, but in principal, it is a site-killer. To wit -

1. One of the ways people find this site is by doing searches on sites like Bing, Yahoo and Goober. If I lock the content all down so only members can see it, that means the search engines can no longer 'see' our content. Which means they can no longer index it. Which means if someone does a Goober search for T-Buckets, all they will see are the 'other' sites, which clearly cannot offer anyone the content we have here. So we will lose the new, potential members. And that means the forum sponsors will see traffic taking a nosedive and will start pulling out.

2. If we lock down all the content, then people cannot see the wealth of knowledge this site can offer. And who wants to subscribe to anything, sight unseen? Again, this amounts to losing new, potential members.

3. If we lock the site down, I think you can depend on the majority of the inactive and non-donating members to disappear. I don't care to speculate on anyone's financial condition, but there may be some who simply do not have the extra dosh to donate. A few months back, I was unemployed and couldn't afford to pay attention, let alone subscription fees. And I really do not want to turn them away, if they cannot afford to subscribe. Then you have others who would simply shrug their shoulders and walk away, refusing to budge off the price of a trip to the golden arches drive-thru. Drive them off and we will be left with the remaining 60 - 65 members who have already made a practice of donating to the site. And it would take each one of them making regular $5/monthly donations to keep the site alive. If a handful end up not donating one month, then we are right back where we started.

I wish there was an easy answer to all of this, but the truth is there just isn't.

By all means, I agree with the suggestions that premium features and functions should be something reserved for the members who are helping to get and keep those features and functions in place.
 
I second Telman2's proposal.

I like the way Jimbo & Mike J are thinking but totally understand the potential for it to be a site killer. You shouldn't force everyone to donate, but reward those who do by providing extra services.
 
I know I`m a newbie and my opinion probably means diddly, but if you had to pay to join the site I would have kept going when I found it. I agree that if it is pay to join that the site would probably go away. Making a few of the forums pay to veiw so to speak might hurt membership also. Notice I said "might" because nobody can say for sure.

I do like this site and the relaxed attitude everybody seems to have, not like a few other boards i`ve been on where you get smart a@@ answers to simple questions. I do plan on making a donation to the site because of what I`ve learned in the short time I`ve been here, hopefully this month. I too had a major setback a couple years ago. Hurts going from $21.00 bucks an hour to $10.00, but you do what you gotta do as the saying goes.
Anyhoo, lets do what what we can to keep yhis place going, if not I`ll have to spend more time talking to my ol` lady.:rolleyes:;)
Sorry for the long rant and thanks for listening, Joe.
 
I know I`m a newbie and my opinion probably means diddly...
No, don't think that way. Your input is valuable, so never hesitate to make your thoughts known. I appreciate what you had to say, because you represent a different point of perspective.

Hurts going from $21.00 bucks an hour to $10.00, but you do what you gotta do as the saying goes.
I feel your pain, believe me. Working at Purdue gives me some incredible employee benefits, and those benefits certainly do add value to my income. But the grocery stores, the gas stations and the utility companies won't accept benefits for payment. I went from making a good wage, to earning stupid amounts of money, to working for chump change and it has been a real wake-up call.
 
I'd like to see more people weigh in as well. The way I see it and correct me if I'm wrong please. The options are

Not enough donations and the site goes bust?
OR
Membership dues and the site goes bust because members flee?
OR
Sit and do nothing and wait to see what the future holds.

I can understand everyone has a different income structure. I too can understand that the current economy sucks as I was a victim as well. I too was out of work for a year. My situation was different then most as that is when I started my Bucket. I had the time and took full advantage of it. How many people are at the library using the computer lab to access this site? Seems everyone is so hard up that everything must go but the good ole internet. Everyone here ads value to the site. Each of us bring something to the table in different forms. There are a lot of talented people here -vs- the other sites. This site doesn't have the clicks, grab ass or ego stroking going on. Were all here for one common purpose. The love of T-Buckets and information sharing. I'm just puzzled I guess. I feel like I'm paying my way so someone else can enjoy it too. I don't mind pitching in and helping a fellow hot rodder at all. I just think from time to time everyone can flip a five spot in the collection basket to keep this popular hang out open without fear or hearing the end of the tunnel scenario a couple of times a year for the same reasons.
 
This site is too valuable to disappear. I have learned a lot and met some great people because of it. I like the idea of making a gallery/library and possibly some other special areas, contributor areas only, would definitely help people decide to contribute as their level of knowledge and need for more information grows. Keep up the good work Mike I will continue to support when and how I am able.
 
I've seen a lot more guests then most sites. So if you could lock out the threads with build pics and others that are member specific photos that would help a lot I think.
 
Hurts going from $21.00 bucks an hour to $10.00, but you do what you gotta do as the saying goes.​
I feel your pain, believe me. Working at Purdue gives me some incredible employee benefits, and those benefits certainly do add value to my income. But the grocery stores, the gas stations and the utility companies won't accept benefits for payment. I went from making a good wage, to earning stupid amounts of money, to working for chump change and it has been a real wake-up call.

Wakeup call is from very comfy to nothing and no Insurance with no prospects at all where I live. Been living off of building outdoor furniture. Winter time is hell on sales,
 
Jimbo, whilst that was not the original intent behind this particular thread, yes, those are some very real, underlying issues that we face each month. Money makes the world go around.

What I was actually looking to learn was how everyone feels about the current feature set we have on the site and what they felt would be the best way forward, for the future.

This site doesn't have the clicks, grab ass or ego stroking going on.
I am happy you feel this way. Actually, I am always pleased to hear people say things along this line. I made a personal decision to avoid the other sites, so I really don't know what happens on any of them. Every now and again, someone will mention something that they have seen, but my decision is to stay away from those sites. Both Corley and the sockpuppet were caught out, using our resources to trawl our site, in an effort to lure away our members and our sponsors. I have never and will never resort to those kinds of cheap tactics. I don't ever want the owners and admins of the other sites to think I might be playing that kind of game, so I just stay away. Sure, I would love to participate on those sites, with a backlink to this one in a signature file, because those would be some high-value links. But I'll stick to my method of building traffic naturally, as it has always seemed to work well for us.

Joe, we get a lot of guests because since the day we opened, I have really worked hard on optimizing the site for the search engines. That lets us rank well on search engine results pages, so we derive a lot of traffic from those pages. The more traffic we see, the more potential we have to register new members.
 
As it stands now without any added features, I check the donations section near the end of every month and always worry that the site will shut down. I've been supporting this site when I can for a long time, and so have others more than me and that's great. This is a fabulous blue-collar, meat & potatoes site that provides a ton of expertise I can't get anywhere else. My fear is that if you get too fancy and have to increase the monthly target, it becomes a crap-shoot at that point. We need to be comfortably self-sustaining.
Craig
 
Current feature set is fine, but I.M.O. if your building one of these cars and are putting thousands of $ into huge motors and chrome( or not), then you should be able to afford a membership and/ or donate a small amount once a month. I.M.O.
 
Mike J :thumbsup: Web site is just fine the way it is. Lets just work on donating first .
 

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