Are you kidding me!?
- Thread starter tfeverfred
- Start date
Mike
Well-Known Member
Who knows?
The NHRA is established as a 501(c)(6), so it comes down to a question of who actually 'owns' a 501(c).
Some interesting documents here - ::: Drag Racing Online ::: 2006 NHRA Tax Returns - 02/12/08
The NHRA is established as a 501(c)(6), so it comes down to a question of who actually 'owns' a 501(c).
Some interesting documents here - ::: Drag Racing Online ::: 2006 NHRA Tax Returns - 02/12/08
Mike
Well-Known Member
The 1000' Tune-Up - www.nitromater.com
Those are comments from a couple of the sport's top fuel tuners.
Below, you can see what John Force has to say -
Force Supports Plan, For Now
Interesting how the guys tuning the cars are supportive, where NHRA's poster boy says he supports the plan 'for now'. Somebody once made the comment Force spends money like a drunken sailor, so I reckon he doesn't mind eating up all the parts in the last 320'.
It's a bit of a shame to say it, but when people ask why there is so much carnage in the AA/FC's, you about have to point your figure at Force Racing. People are trying to run their cars the way the Force cars are run, with nowhere near the budget.
Those are comments from a couple of the sport's top fuel tuners.
Below, you can see what John Force has to say -
Force Supports Plan, For Now
Interesting how the guys tuning the cars are supportive, where NHRA's poster boy says he supports the plan 'for now'. Somebody once made the comment Force spends money like a drunken sailor, so I reckon he doesn't mind eating up all the parts in the last 320'.
It's a bit of a shame to say it, but when people ask why there is so much carnage in the AA/FC's, you about have to point your figure at Force Racing. People are trying to run their cars the way the Force cars are run, with nowhere near the budget.
Mike
Well-Known Member
Drag Racing Internet Magazine - Competition Plus.com - DALE ARMSTRONG INTERVIEW - THE BEST PLAN FOR SLOWING TOP FUEL DRAGSTERS AND FUNNY CARS
I nearly fell out of the chair laughing, when I read this bit -
I've seen some things that would absolutely chill your blood. Decisions being made by crewchiefs that put not only their drivers, but spectators at risk.
In the days of the T/F cars using dual nosewings, the wing angle was determined by plates that bolted to the chassis. If you wanted to change the angle, you pulled the wings, bolted in a pair of blocks to provide the desired angle and then put the wings back on. One crewchief demanded the angle blocks for his cars be made from mag, instead of aluminum.
I once opened a package that came from a very prominent fuel team. It contained a motorplate from that team's car. The only problem was this particular motorplate was made of aluminum, when the rules clearly specify the plates must be steel. Have you ever seen pictures of cars that suffered clutch explosions? Then you'll understand why the rules specify steel plates. The really interesting thing about this plate was that you could hang a magnet on the plate.
How about the spectators dodging shrapnel from the Pro Stock team's nitrous explosion in their pits, at Columbus? (If you were there for that one, it was rather ironic where the nitrous bottle ended up, when it finally came to rest.) Jenkins was with me when that happened and he muttered it had to have been a nitrous explosion in Team X's car or Team Y's car. One of the cars he named was indeed the car. And we were back in the Comp pits when it exploded. That old boy doesn't miss much.
Oh, yeah, there are a lot of crewchiefs who know they can get away with a lot more that you might imagine.
And it's bad enough, because some really scary things can happen, without trying stunts like these.
Before the rule was made to require covers over the spark plugs on the fuel cars, a guy I grew up with was tuning on a privateer's T/F car. They suffered a tremendous explosion about 40 feet off the starting line at Topeka. Ever been to Topeka? Sitting in the stands, you almost need binoculaurs to see the track. Any way, the motor spit the plugs out of one bank and they were gone, nowhere to be found. Later that evening, a guy hobbled up to their pit on crutches, with his lower leg in a cast. He wanted the driver to autograph his cast, since it was one of the errant spark plugs that had broken his ankle, as he sat in the stands. But the guy was cool with it all, because NHRA had covered the medical expenses and had given him credentials to get into the races for free.
I nearly fell out of the chair laughing, when I read this bit -
Boy howdy! I've seen AA/Dale's tricks with these two eyes.
I've seen some things that would absolutely chill your blood. Decisions being made by crewchiefs that put not only their drivers, but spectators at risk.
In the days of the T/F cars using dual nosewings, the wing angle was determined by plates that bolted to the chassis. If you wanted to change the angle, you pulled the wings, bolted in a pair of blocks to provide the desired angle and then put the wings back on. One crewchief demanded the angle blocks for his cars be made from mag, instead of aluminum.
I once opened a package that came from a very prominent fuel team. It contained a motorplate from that team's car. The only problem was this particular motorplate was made of aluminum, when the rules clearly specify the plates must be steel. Have you ever seen pictures of cars that suffered clutch explosions? Then you'll understand why the rules specify steel plates. The really interesting thing about this plate was that you could hang a magnet on the plate.
How about the spectators dodging shrapnel from the Pro Stock team's nitrous explosion in their pits, at Columbus? (If you were there for that one, it was rather ironic where the nitrous bottle ended up, when it finally came to rest.
) Jenkins was with me when that happened and he muttered it had to have been a nitrous explosion in Team X's car or Team Y's car. One of the cars he named was indeed the car. And we were back in the Comp pits when it exploded. That old boy doesn't miss much. Oh, yeah, there are a lot of crewchiefs who know they can get away with a lot more that you might imagine.
And it's bad enough, because some really scary things can happen, without trying stunts like these.
Before the rule was made to require covers over the spark plugs on the fuel cars, a guy I grew up with was tuning on a privateer's T/F car. They suffered a tremendous explosion about 40 feet off the starting line at Topeka. Ever been to Topeka? Sitting in the stands, you almost need binoculaurs to see the track. Any way, the motor spit the plugs out of one bank and they were gone, nowhere to be found. Later that evening, a guy hobbled up to their pit on crutches, with his lower leg in a cast. He wanted the driver to autograph his cast, since it was one of the errant spark plugs that had broken his ankle, as he sat in the stands. But the guy was cool with it all, because NHRA had covered the medical expenses and had given him credentials to get into the races for free.
Mike
Well-Known Member
Sounds like someone forgot to tell 'Dim' what the party line was going to be and he fouled it up, big style.
Drag Racing Internet Magazine - Competition Plus.com - MORE ON PEDREGON'S GATE INCIDENT
Drag Racing Internet Magazine - Competition Plus.com - MORE ON PEDREGON'S GATE INCIDENT
Mike
Well-Known Member
Sheesh, it's now become obvious the 1,000 ft tracks are not going to save anyone on fuel costs.
Effective this weekend at Denver, the 40 gallon drums of nitromethane will cost $1,693.00. And if you think that is a tough pill to swallow, how about the price being increased to $1,822.00 at the Seattle race on the following weekend?
The $1,822.00 price is only guaranteed through Indy.
Effective this weekend at Denver, the 40 gallon drums of nitromethane will cost $1,693.00. And if you think that is a tough pill to swallow, how about the price being increased to $1,822.00 at the Seattle race on the following weekend?
The $1,822.00 price is only guaranteed through Indy.
Mike
Well-Known Member
I noticed four T/F cars skipped the fourth and final qualifying session at Denver, last evening.
Hillary Will, Steve Torrence, Steve Chrisman and Antron Brown opted to save the money. Of course, seeing as there were only 15 cars in attendance...
I get a charge out of people like Ken Black griping about the cost of running a T/F car. His Pro Stock team is solely responsible for raising the financial bar so high in that category, but now he's kicking about nitro costs.
When I worked at McKinney Corp, the fuel guys were all a hoot. Ercie Hall would be on one line complaining about the price on everything, while Dan Olsen was on the other line, griping that the reverser cable bracket we had built for him was made of chrome-moly, instead of titanium. Or as Ercie always called it, unobtanium.
Blow-overs were still pretty common then and Jimmy Prock called about coming up with a wheelie bar design for Amato's car. We made up a set and fired them to him, followed shortly by his irate phone call, griping that the bars were not made of titanium.
When Lee Beard went to work for Kenny Bernstein, the cars came to the shop to get back-halved for Lee's combination. They would strip the absolute minimum off the cars to get them back in the jig and then start cutting. I was walking through the jig shop and noticed a chunk of lead bolted into the nose of the car. With a titanium bolt, no less! :toast:
Those guys didn't want the aluminum throttle pedals we made for the dragsters, so we ended up milling them out of mag for most of the teams. (One of the machinists nearly burned the building to the ground on the first one he did, but that's another story. Let's just say mag burns fast and hot!)
Our gas dragster used a dual-disc clutch and a Liberty air-shifted five-speed. Weight was always an issue, so we used a titanium can. We were wanting to try some different levers on the clutch, but we couldn't sort the geometry, so we had Tim Richards take a look at it. His fix was simple. Jerk the titanium can out and have a custom can built for the car, to get the depth right for what we were doing. :welcome:
All of those teams have created this monster and now they are all complaining about it. I am really struggling to have a lot of sympathy for them.
Hillary Will, Steve Torrence, Steve Chrisman and Antron Brown opted to save the money. Of course, seeing as there were only 15 cars in attendance...
I get a charge out of people like Ken Black griping about the cost of running a T/F car. His Pro Stock team is solely responsible for raising the financial bar so high in that category, but now he's kicking about nitro costs.
When I worked at McKinney Corp, the fuel guys were all a hoot. Ercie Hall would be on one line complaining about the price on everything, while Dan Olsen was on the other line, griping that the reverser cable bracket we had built for him was made of chrome-moly, instead of titanium. Or as Ercie always called it, unobtanium.
Blow-overs were still pretty common then and Jimmy Prock called about coming up with a wheelie bar design for Amato's car. We made up a set and fired them to him, followed shortly by his irate phone call, griping that the bars were not made of titanium.
When Lee Beard went to work for Kenny Bernstein, the cars came to the shop to get back-halved for Lee's combination. They would strip the absolute minimum off the cars to get them back in the jig and then start cutting. I was walking through the jig shop and noticed a chunk of lead bolted into the nose of the car. With a titanium bolt, no less! :toast:
Those guys didn't want the aluminum throttle pedals we made for the dragsters, so we ended up milling them out of mag for most of the teams. (One of the machinists nearly burned the building to the ground on the first one he did, but that's another story. Let's just say mag burns fast and hot!)
Our gas dragster used a dual-disc clutch and a Liberty air-shifted five-speed. Weight was always an issue, so we used a titanium can. We were wanting to try some different levers on the clutch, but we couldn't sort the geometry, so we had Tim Richards take a look at it. His fix was simple. Jerk the titanium can out and have a custom can built for the car, to get the depth right for what we were doing. :welcome:
All of those teams have created this monster and now they are all complaining about it. I am really struggling to have a lot of sympathy for them.
Great thread guys!
My perspective is that Top fuel FCs and dragsters are just making too damn much horsepower now, it is incredibly insane. Alcohol cars are a very close second. It is entertainment second to none for the spectators but you would have to be nuts to drive one of those things. NHRA knows that the big boys brings in the $$$$ to these events. Shortening the race to 1000' is a responsible but will be unpopular, it is with me too Fred. Who knows what the answer is, I figured something like this was inevitable. Seems like everything that is fun with americans is also dangerous, the nature of the beast. Here we are building 1500 lb cars with big blocks with a wheezer sitting on top without a roll bar or cage, no less.
Steve
My perspective is that Top fuel FCs and dragsters are just making too damn much horsepower now, it is incredibly insane. Alcohol cars are a very close second. It is entertainment second to none for the spectators but you would have to be nuts to drive one of those things. NHRA knows that the big boys brings in the $$$$ to these events. Shortening the race to 1000' is a responsible but will be unpopular, it is with me too Fred. Who knows what the answer is, I figured something like this was inevitable. Seems like everything that is fun with americans is also dangerous, the nature of the beast. Here we are building 1500 lb cars with big blocks with a wheezer sitting on top without a roll bar or cage, no less.
Steve
Mike
Well-Known Member
The bottom line is that the fuel cars are no longer going to be unlimited classes (as if they haven't already had restrictions for years).
The really good cars have been atop the rev limiters around 1,000 ft. anyway, so going back to 1,320 ft. isn't really solving much.
NHRA has admitted they are looking to slow the cars down, so 4.40's and 330+ MPH are going to be a thing of the past. What is better - a 5.00 pass in 1,320 ft. or a 3.99 in 1,000?
What would seem to make the most sense would be to limit blower size, come back to one mag and one fuel pump, reduce wing and spoiler sizes and let them race. But that will suddenly make the A/FD cars look almost as fast as the T/F cars, so the solution isn't necessarily so easy.
We thought minimum weights were wrong, when NHRA enforced them. We thought the reduced nitro percentages were wrong, when NHRA enforced them. We thought the rev limiters were wrong, when NHRA enforced them. Unfortunately, we're going to have to accept whatever new changes come along, just as we've accepted the others.
Personally, I am happy NHRA has decided to make some immediate changes. I don't like seeing friends being killed. The sport is meant to be fun and that certainly wasn't.
The really good cars have been atop the rev limiters around 1,000 ft. anyway, so going back to 1,320 ft. isn't really solving much.
NHRA has admitted they are looking to slow the cars down, so 4.40's and 330+ MPH are going to be a thing of the past. What is better - a 5.00 pass in 1,320 ft. or a 3.99 in 1,000?
What would seem to make the most sense would be to limit blower size, come back to one mag and one fuel pump, reduce wing and spoiler sizes and let them race. But that will suddenly make the A/FD cars look almost as fast as the T/F cars, so the solution isn't necessarily so easy.
We thought minimum weights were wrong, when NHRA enforced them. We thought the reduced nitro percentages were wrong, when NHRA enforced them. We thought the rev limiters were wrong, when NHRA enforced them. Unfortunately, we're going to have to accept whatever new changes come along, just as we've accepted the others.
Personally, I am happy NHRA has decided to make some immediate changes. I don't like seeing friends being killed. The sport is meant to be fun and that certainly wasn't.
Mike said:
The game definately changes when somebody you know or a friend is KIA.
If they slow the top fuel cars down then there probably wont be a need for their class with the alky cars running as good as they do, they are just a red hair away from them now in sensible terms anyhow
