Frame and body twist

[Bryan C]

Question on frame/body twist with a high HP and TQ motor in a T Bucket. I am having a Spirit 23 T Bucket built with a Rossler T3 TH400, and a Ray Barton 540 blown FI Hemi. Yes, it is overkill, but this is my retirement bucket list as I've always wanted a T and I am a Gen II Hemi fan! When Ray's shop ran the completed engine on the dyno a few days ago, 2 of the techs HIGHLY recommended an engine mid plate, to help in frame twist. This car will never be raced. It will be a show and road rally car. Will I chirp the tires once in a while, sure. Who doesn't? Question is I realize there will be frame twist if the throttle is too aggressive, but how will the fiberglass body hold up?

 

[Spanky]

In most T-buckets the body "sits" on the frame. Since it's not rigidly connected to the frame rails, it should have enough "flex" to handle the torque-twist of that big hemi. Mid-plate and gusseted cross members should keep your frame stable.

(Love to see pics when that bad boy hits the road!)

 

[Bryan C]

In most T-buckets the body "sits" on the frame. Since it's not rigidly connected to the frame rails, it should have enough "flex" to handle the torque-twist of that big hemi. Mid-plate and gusseted cross members should keep your frame stable.

(Love to see pics when that bad boy hits the road!)

Thanks Spanky. I was kind of hoping that was the case. I did try to upload a pic of the engine when it was being set up for the dyno, but apparently the file was too large and I'm not tech savvy enough to figure out how to compress it.

 

[RodStRace]

A blown big inch hemi is going to twist all sorts of stuff. A typical T frame is not set up for that. You can add crossmembers, but they will not be flat between the frame rails due to engine/trans placement. It was common to have a tubular U shaped under pan crossmember on the TP chassis.

Also, high HP drag cars with a full cage and midplates will have rods from the rails back to the engine plate so that big mass won't try to move back during high G launches. You don't need to do that, since you probably aren't going to set up the car to launch that hard.

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As you can see from those plates, they are designed to have support not just at the frame rails, but also higher up where the other tube frame members intersect the plate.

There is a guy that has a blown T bucket on You tube.

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There are plenty of others, too. Take a look at them and see what support systems are needed to keep them running longer than a quick trip around the fairgrounds. I'm talking cooling (engine and trans) a good fuel system and stronger suspension to handle the extra weight and power.

You can also do searches here for more opinions on what you can do to build and keep alive a high HP T.

Thread 'How much HP is too much?'

May 22, 2008

Can a T bucket really use all the power in a blown big block? Short of an all out drag racing set up, how much power can a 2000# street car transmit to the pavement. They sure look cool, and if all that power can really be hooked up it would have to make for one hell of a ride, but is there a point at which you really are just spinning your tires.

• Martin
• Replies: 30
• Forum: Engines and Drivelines

 

[Spanky]

I did try to upload a pic of the engine when it was being set up for the dyno, but apparently the file was too large and I'm not tech savvy enough to figure out how to compress it.

Here's a picture of Bryan's engine - eye candy!

 

[RodStRace]

You know, if it's adrenaline and danger you are after, you can just get one of these.

New electric unicycle hits an insane 93 MPH top speed

 

[409T]

I think the obvious is how large are the frame rails and what thickness is the rail wall? 2 X 4 X 1/4 will not need anything else to stiffen it. 2 X 3 X 3/16 will flex some, but I would guess will still be OK. I have a blown 392 hemi on a 2 X 4 X 3/16 frame and it is fine. Adding plates, gussets, etc. will only be as good as the welds.

 

[PotvinGuy]

drive like grandma and you'll do fine.

 

[Spanky]

drive like grandma and you'll do fine.

 

[Pasthisprime]

Question on frame/body twist with a high HP and TQ motor in a T Bucket. I am having a Spirit 23 T Bucket built with a Rossler T3 TH400, and a Ray Barton 540 blown FI Hemi. Yes, it is overkill, but this is my retirement bucket list as I've always wanted a T and I am a Gen II Hemi fan! When Ray's shop ran the completed engine on the dyno a few days ago, 2 of the techs HIGHLY recommended an engine mid plate, to help in frame twist. This car will never be raced. It will be a show and road rally car. Will I chirp the tires once in a while, sure. Who doesn't? Question is I realize there will be frame twist if the throttle is too aggressive, but how will the fiberglass body hold up?

As a drag racer I can tell you that chassis will never withstand that engine. I have a Spirit model A Chassis and I appreciate the care they put into it I needed to do some serious modifications. I run 900hp twin turbo SBF. The easiest and best way to strengthen this is to start with a minimum of 2x4 x 3/16” rails and a full roll cage. A motor plate is a great idea as well. You say you won’t race it but 5-600ft lbs of torque is available in this engine’s normal operating range. Keep in mind that the Speedway axle is only rated for car weights about 2500 lbs. you are asking a lot of it. Also, you will need a 9” rear with substantial four link or trailing arms, no wimpy four bar!!! Keep in mind the frame is the foundation of it all, you don’t want to redo it!