Front suspension

[maxwedge426]

I am in the process of mocking up my first T Bucket. I purchased the front axle from Ron Pope and the steering arms from Speedway. I have made the frame from lumber cut to match the size of the tubing that I will be using. My first question is, do most builders use a round front cross member so that the tie rod has more room to move up and down? I mocked it up with a square tube, but it looks like the axle will have to move farther out in front to have tie rod clearance. My spring perch is tangent with the top of the crossmember.
My second question is regarding the Ackerman Triangle. I have mocked everything up as close as possible, but it looks like the 3rd point of the triangle will be about 10-15 ft behind the car. How big a deal is that?
Thanks in advance

 

[Ted Brown]

Take your time and do it right, Mr. Ackerman will reward you for it... Are you keeping the tie rod behind the axle, like it should be? either in the lower position or above the frame and perch, to the top side of the spindle. The front cross member is up to you and how it looks best to you... I myself like a 2 1/2" X .188 wall tube front cross member, total width of my frame in front is 23 1/2 inches... Hope this helped.

 

[maxwedge426]

Take your time and do it right, Mr. Ackerman will reward you for it... Are you keeping the tie rod behind the axle, like it should be? either in the lower position or above the frame and perch, to the top side of the spindle. The front cross member is up to you and how it looks best to you... I myself like a 2 1/2" X .188 wall tube front cross member, total width of my frame in front is 23 1/2 inches... Hope this helped.

 

[maxwedge426]

thanks for your response. This will be a cross steer system. I noticed that as I mocked the front axle into position with the spring perch flush with the top of the front crossmember, that there was not a lot of ropm for vertical travel for the tie rod. the other thing that happens is if the steering rod should start out parallel to the tie rod, that puts the cross steer box very close to where the radiator sits. This means that the farthur out in front of the frame the axle is mounted, the farthur forward the steering box moves. Is it safe to say that the steering rod should be parallel to the tie rod when the wheels are pointed straight ahead?
In regards to the Ackerman, do builders regularly cut the flat steering arms to get the Ackerman geometry? I had read a previous post about shimming the steering arms with spacers and I am not sure that is a good idea. It seems strange that someone would sell parts to the general public that are not correct. I realize there are a wide range of potential uses, but I would think they would be close.

 

[Ted Brown]

Ackerman and steering arms, The main reason that a shim or two may be needed is the different wheel bases... I just make my own arms, and weld them to the spindle in the correct position for whatever wheel base the car has...

 

[EX JUNK]

thanks for your response. This will be a cross steer system. I noticed that as I mocked the front axle into position with the spring perch flush with the top of the front crossmember, that there was not a lot of ropm for vertical travel for the tie rod. the other thing that happens is if the steering rod should start out parallel to the tie rod, that puts the cross steer box very close to where the radiator sits. This means that the farthur out in front of the frame the axle is mounted, the farthur forward the steering box moves. Is it safe to say that the steering rod should be parallel to the tie rod when the wheels are pointed straight ahead?
In regards to the Ackerman, do builders regularly cut the flat steering arms to get the Ackerman geometry? I had read a previous post about shimming the steering arms with spacers and I am not sure that is a good idea. It seems strange that someone would sell parts to the general public that are not correct. I realize there are a wide range of potential uses, but I would think they would be close.

Divorcecar, I have a Vega box for my cross steer set up. I also made new steering arms to be able to maintain proper Ackerman. There are some that do not believe that proper Ackerman is that important but I believe, along with many others, that it is. I am also not too concerned about having my tie rod in front of my axle. Sure, it can get bent if you use it as a bumper or are in an accident but there will, more than likely, be a lot more damage than a bent tie rod to worry about.

I have included a few pictures that may give you some help or ideas. The first shot shows the new steering arms that allow correct Ackerman.

Here is the mounting of the Vega box.

And a view from the underside.

Here are a couple of shots of the steering arm. As you can see, it is parallel with the tie rod.

I don't mean to step on anyone's toes but this is my opinion on your questions. You can take it for what its worth.

Jim

 

[Toms26T]

What ground clearance do you have with your set-up Jim?

 

[maxwedge426]

thanks Jim
The pictures were worth a thousand words. It is pretty easy to see that you have addressed the Ackerman issue. I realized after looking at your pictures that I could attach my tie rod, which is on the backside of the axle, to the bottom of the steering arms to gain some clearance. I also have a little more comfort about the location of the vega box.
Thank you, Thank you

 

[EX JUNK]

What ground clearance do you have with your set-up Jim?

My ground clearances are as follows:

1. Axle - 5 1/4"

2. Tie rod - 9"

3. Four bar bracket - 3 1/8"

4. Drag link @ steering box - 3"

5. Drag link @ steering arm - 5 1/2"

6. Oil pan - 3"

As you can see, my car is built low but outside of a few very minor scratches on the bottom of my SLAMGUARD pan, everything else remains unscathed in over 13K miles. I don't take my car "off roading", I was into that many years ago and had a Jeep and a dune buggy.

Jim