steering arm, tie rod question

[rodjr]

I am working on coming up with a steering / axle/ ride height arrangement before i start dropping $$. My question is if i run the tie rod behind the axle but on top, how far behind the axle (approximately) will the tie rod be? i have a 28 grill shell that is on top of my front crossmember (actually about 3/4" forward) and i am trying to guess how far to put the spring behind to avoid tie rod to radiator interference.
Also wondering if there is a particular spindle design that would have the advantage of putting the tie rod closer to the axle.
I plan to do traditional steer with reverse corvair or sprint car style. I plan to have 9"+/- under the front rail, and need a 4" drop axle to get there, so i think tie rod under frame would take extended, heavily dropped arms which i can't find.

 

[choppedtop]

From the rear of the axle, to the rear of the tie rod, mine measures 5 1/2". My tie rod is on the bottom, so with caster, if on top it may be a bit farther back. My tie rod only clears bottom of frame 3/4" and has never contacted the frame.

 

[RESINATOR]

I will get you a dimension tomorrow from the center of the axle to the center of the spring to clear the shell, also a few arm dimensions.

 

[rodjr]

Wow, that would be great, that pic is actually my inspiration. My goal is to have the spring under the grill shell with a longer batwing to move the perches back. I would have liked to run the tie rod under but with the center of the spindles 3/4" - 1" above the top of the rail, and more space between axle and spring, i really don't think i can make it work. In reality, even with the spring in front of the grill, i would be real happy if i could cut the front crossmember off the car in that pic and weld that whole front end on my frame.

 

[ellis8500]

Remember to include the Ackerman. T = (D-a)/D x A for tie rod behind axle. +a for tie rod in front. A = distance between kingpins, a = kingpin to steering arm hole, D = axle to rear axle. All based on zero toe. Leave enough adjustment on tie rod to set toe in or out as needed. T = tie rod length with joints installed.

 

[old round fart]

Sounds like you want a '32 Ford kind of front end. The spring is over the axle to clear the tie rod and steering. I have never seen that done on a T but I was looking at it for mine. If you want the spring under the shell and the spring in front of the spring look at CCR's setup. They have the spring behind and tie rod above the frame just like you wand, plus they support this site! WIN WIN!!

 

[old round fart]

OOPS! Just went back and re drooled at the CCR website and the tie rod would go through the radiator! You can still do it with with the tie rod under the frame. That would clean up the front even more.

 

[PotvinGuy]

I will get you a dimension tomorrow from the center of the axle to the center of the spring to clear the shell, also a few arm dimensions.

View attachment 11188

Jerry, how's that monoleaf working out? Sure looks clean.

 

[RESINATOR]

I have put them on every Roadster I have ever owned, love them with a good gas charged shock (Bilsteins).
Saw this a the L.A Roadsters years back, from Shadow Rods I think.
They dropped the ball with the drag link but with the extended steering arms from Super Bell they figured out a place for the tie rod.

 

[rodjr]

How far above the bottom of the frame can the spindle center be, and still have any hope of going under the frame with the tie rod? I am curious about the monoleaf also, I am planning to use one and wonder how it will be with my short wheelbase, very, very, light car?

 

[RESINATOR]

Rodjr, The distance from the center of the axle to the center of the spring is 3". The steering arms (Magnum/TCI) put the tie rod at 5" back (to center) from the center of the axle. This is the perch I used.

 

[RESINATOR]

Going under the frame is easy, clearing the suspension bars and having sufficient travel is the problem. You want to avoid having the tie rod as the low point of the car.

 

[rodjr]

Rodjr, The distance from the center of the axle to the center of the spring is 3". The steering arms (Magnum/TCI) put the tie rod at 5" back (to center) from the center of the axle. This is the perch I used.

View attachment 11194 View attachment 11195

I sent you a pm regarding a possible purchase.

 

[Ratrod1967]

I am working on coming up with a steering / axle/ ride height arrangement before i start dropping $$. My question is if i run the tie rod behind the axle but on top, how far behind the axle (approximately) will the tie rod be? i have a 28 grill shell that is on top of my front crossmember (actually about 3/4" forward) and i am trying to guess how far to put the spring behind to avoid tie rod to radiator interference.
Also wondering if there is a particular spindle design that would have the advantage of putting the tie rod closer to the axle.
I plan to do traditional steer with reverse corvair or sprint car style. I plan to have 9"+/- under the front rail, and need a 4" drop axle to get there, so i think tie rod under frame would take extended, heavily dropped arms which i can't find.

You guys sound pretty knowledgeable on steering and suspension. I have a straight axle, monoleaf front end and I am trying to run the steering connecting rod out front. I am told that i need to find a different steering arm set up or modify the ones I have to correct my Ackerman angle. I would rather buy a bolt on steering arm than heat and bend the ones I have. Is there anything out there???

 

[roadmonster]

You really should avoid a high or forward tie rod, especially at the design stage. You can run a low tie rod behind the axle and avoid a lot of problems. Good Ackerman, easy-driving car with low-behind tie rod.

 

[butch27]

I try to never make my front tie rod into my front BUMPER.

 

[Zandoz]

You guys sound pretty knowledgeable on steering and suspension. I have a straight axle, monoleaf front end and I am trying to run the steering connecting rod out front. I am told that i need to find a different steering arm set up or modify the ones I have to correct my Ackerman angle. I would rather buy a bolt on steering arm than heat and bend the ones I have. Is there anything out there???

LOWER STEERING ARMS - WINTEC Fabrication

 

[EX JUNK]

I try to never make my front tie rod into my front BUMPER.

If you use it as a front bumper it's time to turn in your drivers license. IMHO

Jim

 

[Zandoz]

If you use it as a front bumper it's time to turn in your drivers license. IMHO

Jim

Especially since the tie rod is not going to be out in front of the tires. I think it's funny that the bumper argument still comes up almost always when the front tie rod configuration is mentioned...and has not gone the way of the dodo bird and pet rocks.

 

[EX JUNK]

Especially since the tie rod is not going to be out in front of the tires. I think it's funny that the bumper argument still comes up almost always when the front tie rod configuration is mentioned...and has not gone the way of the dodo bird and pet rocks.

Not only that but the tie rod sits lower than the bumpers on most cars. If you hit something with it, you should NOT be driving!

Jim