Steering mounted high in body?

[raidmagic]

I've searched some but not sure of the terms I am looking for to search so I'm not finding what I am looking for.
What are the pros and cons of mounting my steering box up high inside the body and coming out of the side of the body with the pitman arm. The reason I'm thinking about this is I'm considering putting a 5 speed I have in the car and need the floor space for pedals. Also I don't want it on the frame outside the firewall as I just don't have alot of space and I like the clean look of it not being there.
What type of structure would I need to build to mount the steering box there?
Thanks for your tips.

 

[RexRod]

Hi RaidMagic,

The type of steering you're talking about is called "Cowl Steering."

If you search google, you will get all kinds of cool ideas from other projects. I also think Track-T did cowl steering on his project. His stuff is pretty cool.

David

 

[Track-T]

RexRod, Your pay check is in the mail....
here's mine out of the car...reversed corvair box. I made all the other stuff.
Main thing is MAKE IT STRONG there is alot of stress on the steering.
DO NOT use stock firewall,Mine is 1 1/2" thick bracket is mounted with
6 3/8" stainless bolts.
if you are planning on hanging pedals it will not work well.not enough room behind
the dash.

 

[RPM]

RexRod, Your pay check is in the mail....
here's mine out of the car...reversed corvair box. I made all the other stuff.
Main thing is MAKE IT STRONG there is alot of stress on the steering.
DO NOT use stock firewall,Mine is 1 1/2" thick bracket is mounted with
6 3/8" stainless bolts.
if you are planning on hanging pedals it will not work well.not enough room behind
the dash.

I really can't see how that will work. What keeps the extended shaft from turning on the 5/8" thread pitman shaft? Also the stock pitman arm is about 5 1/2" long, this one looks really long and will take away the leverage making the car steer really fast and the wheel hard to turn. Fill us in there please Jim.

 

[bobscogin]

The reason I'm thinking about this is I'm considering putting a 5 speed I have in the car and need the floor space for pedals.

Cowl steering is cool, but most installations I've seen are not done correctly with regard to steering geometry. I put a T5 5 speed in my T and solved the space problem by installing the brake pedal in the usual place coming up through the floor to the left of the steering column, but hanging the clutch pedal under the dash using a hydraulic set up. The clutch master cylinder and pedal pivot mount to a bracket bolted to the interior side of the firewall with braces to the dash and steering column. It took a bit of work, but was worth it. A stick shift hot rod is a blast!

Bob

 

[raidmagic]

Cowl steering is cool, but most installations I've seen are not done correctly with regard to steering geometry. I put a T5 5 speed in my T and solved the space problem by installing the brake pedal in the usual place coming up through the floor to the left of the steering column, but hanging the clutch pedal under the dash using a hydraulic set up. The clutch master cylinder and pedal pivot mount to a bracket bolted to the interior side of the firewall with braces to the dash and steering column. It took a bit of work, but was worth it. A stick shift hot rod is a blast!

Bob

Can you offer up some pics of your set up? I'd like to see it, mounting the master under the dash didn't occur to me.

 

[bobscogin]

Can you offer up some pics of your set up? I'd like to see it, mounting the master under the dash didn't occur to me.

I noted an error in my original post. The brake pedal is to the right of the column, not left as stated. You can see the master cylinder in the upper right of the photo. It's under the dash and not visible unless you stand on your head on the floor!

Bob

 

[bobscogin]

The pushrod that actuates the master cylinder operates through a bellcrank so that I could mount the master cylinder parallel to the firewall. Here's another shot of the master cylinder. The toggle switch you see is for the emergency flashers. It's mounted under the dash and out of sight.

Bob

 

[Track-T]

I really can't see how that will work. What keeps the extended shaft from turning on the 5/8" thread pitman shaft? Also the stock pitman arm is about 5 1/2" long, this one looks really long and will take away the leverage making the car steer really fast and the wheel hard to turn. Fill us in there please Jim.

The threaded pitman shaft has a jam nut plus a 1/4" roll pin.
Yes, the arm was built long so it can be cut and redrilled as needed to bring the
steering speed to where it's needed, much easier to cut then to add. The arm is only
9" long right now.

 

[Brucer]

you want to search for cowl steering

 

[Brucer]

Traditional Steering Components Corvair Reversed boxes Vega steering boxes Pitman Arms

here is a link to an article, streetrodder used it a while back..
Cool Stuff | Driving 'Em Blog & Discussion at Street Rodder Magazine

 

[butch27]

I really wonder about the safety of that long sector shaft extension.

 

[Brucer]

the way i understood it , it was made long so you could cut to length

 

[Youngster]

That was my understandig too Bruser but there should be some lind of suport if the shalf is extended in any way. A pillow block or at least a bushing. Would like to hear GAB's take on this one.

Ron

 

[GAB]

I don't see a problem with extending the sector shaft if it is done properly. The connection between the original shaft and the extension needs to be positive and solid. If I were doing it, I would cut off the splined end of the pittman arm and turn it round to fit in the tube. The tube would need to be big enough to allow the socket for tightening the nut.

As far as supporting the outer end, a bracket that incorporates something in the way of a bearing material to prevent galling should work. Oilite, Delrin, Nylon, or probably quite a few others should do the trick.

 

[Youngster]

Thanks George, knew we could count on you. I have been putzin with mine. I'll post pics soon.

Ron

 

[oldtman]

I've seen some pickup steering gear boxes that have long sector shafts. I don't know if they would be long enough without the adaptor. I think my neighbor used to pay about a grand for his cowl steering on the super modified circle track cars he built.

 

["The Bat" out of hell]

In my view;Cowl steering is one of things used on some old race cars and sprintcars,but not too much on rods tell some newer trents set in[like rat rods and so called track rods]. It's kind of a EZ way out of doing a good design job steering that don't ugly up the cowl. It dose seem to be badly done a lot ,with way too long arms,making steering both hard and to fast,this also add to extra play in steering.
I don't see it as a good design idea on street rods.

 

[Youngster]

While cowl steering is not for everyone it dose solve clearance problems in some cars. A well designed set up actually take s more engineering than a frame mounted box in moat cases. There are alot of shaky set ups done but a well thought out installation is a point of pride for the builder.

Ron