inverted flares

[Francis Blake]

I have been trying to make an acceptable brake line flare, but I seem to be missing something. I have a speedway inverted flaring tool. Every time I make a flare it either tears or the edge is to rough. I fave tried everything I can think of. Should I use a little oil on the flare?

 

[Ted Brown]

I have been trying to make an acceptable brake line flare, but I seem to be missing something. I have a speedway inverted flaring tool. Every time I make a flare it either tears or the edge is to rough. I fave tried everything I can think of. Should I use a little oil on the flare?

That is a double flare? steel line? Make sure that the ends are filed smooth both inside and out before doing the job, and yes a bit of oil won't hurt, but it could make the tube slip in the clamp, so try and not get any on that part of the tube, just a taste on the end at most... but I could be wrong :foottap:

 

[rooster57]

Inverted flares are a lot of work for std brakes.

 

[Northstar T]

I have been trying to make an acceptable brake line flare, but I seem to be missing something. I have a speedway inverted flaring tool. Every time I make a flare it either tears or the edge is to rough. I fave tried everything I can think of. Should I use a little oil on the flare?

An inverted flare shouldn't cause any damage or splitting to the tube end. in fact an inverted flare should cause less stress on the tubing end than a std flare would. I don';t see the kit you refered to in my Speedway catalogue, so can you show a pic of what tool you're using? does it look like a std flare tool but with the addition of a fitting that's placed in the end of the tube, between the flareing tools tip and the tubing being flared?

Russ

 

[Francis Blake]

I am not at home now (on my daughters computer) the tool I am using is in the brake section of the speedway catalog

 

[Ted Brown]

When it comes to brake lines, on all my own older cars, I used copper lines, as they are stronger than the welded steel lines and seal a lot better, they just have to be shielded from harms way, like rocks and all that stuff than ends up on our roadways, (plus vibration)... The main reason the factories started to use steel lines is because they farm those parts out, and copper lines will not hold their shape in the shipping process... Now I use stock factory made lines for a good fit, they come in many different lengths, so all the mounts can be made to fit just fine... :foottap: Never drive faster than your Angel can fly.

 

[Northstar T]

I am not at home now (on my daughters computer) the tool I am using is in the brake section of the speedway catalog

Oh ya. I see it now. that looks similar to what I use, so I don't understand why that should split or tear the end of the tubing. are you refering to the actual end of the tube or the folded over edge of the finished flare? at what point in the flaring process do you begin to see splitting?? I've found that (1) the finished flare will seal much better if not worked down too much by the flaring tool. (2) it's very important to have just the right amount of tubeing exposed beyond the holding fixture. and (3) start with a very square end on the tube.

DO NOT use copper tube for brake lines. the reason factories don't use it is due to a thing called work hardening. the vibration of a vehicle can work harden a fitting or line, which could cause a failure of the system.... unless you feel as lucky as Ted apparantly was :foottap:

Russ

 

[Francis Blake]

Thanks Russ I probably have been putting to much pressure on the flair. Will try again tomorrow and see what I can do. By the way Ted copper lines are ILLEGAL, Missouri requires a through safety inspection on (home built cars)and will not pass copper lines.

 

[Wild Mango]

Thanks Russ I probably have been putting to much pressure on the flair. Will try again tomorrow and see what I can do. By the way Ted copper lines are ILLEGAL, Missouri requires a through safety inspection on (home built cars)and will not pass copper lines.

Bundy tubing which is the common brake line has a small percentage of copper in it to help the ductility. Pure copper tube is a ticket to disaster. If you go to a gun shop and get some case resizing lube (used to lube fired cases before they go in the resize die)use that to lube the part of the tube you are shaping. You can also use electrical wire pulling lube which is a soluble silicon - either product will not introduce seal rotting hydrocarbons to your brake system. I use it to lube the unions as I torque 'em up as well.

 

[GreggDaniels]

I'm at the point in my build where I'm starting to run the brake lines also. I read somewhere, possibly on this site where cutting the lines with tubing cutters will work harden the ends. Try this, I found it works. Cut the line with a hacksaw or dremel tool then deburr the edges well. A little oil on the flaring tool works well also. It makes the flaring go much easier. Also, knowing that we're putting steel shavings everywhere it might be a good idea to either blow the line out with air or maybe spray some brake or carb cleaner in them to make sure there's no debry left in the lines. And yes, 45 degree double flares are mandatory.

 

[Francis Blake]

Thanks for the reply guys. The case lube is a good idea, I use lots of that and have it on hand (pun intended).I will try the hack saw to cut with. I can understand how a tubing would word harden the tube, it seems like I have seen something about that somewhere. Every idea helps.

 

[putz]

Here is a really good video put together by Bob on lines.
[media]

 

[coops]

I have the same eastwood kit and what helped me overcome the same issue was k&w knocker loose,by the way ,mine are stainless very bad about splitting at the ends with all the wall thickness.

 

[estesken]

Another link for videos and tools

http://grtsauto.org/wordpress/?p=354

 

[bigfrank330]

HI
I would use only STEEL LINE and if you have to get another flaring kit
Some of the cheap flaring kits just don't work as intended
I have a hydraulic flaring kit at the shop I work at and the thing is the cat's meow wow it works great
Your local parts store may rent flaring tools -- check with them
the above video's are really good
Frank

 

[GT63]

And yes, 45 degree double flares are mandatory.

Why? reference?

I know several T's that use 37 degree AN fittings on their brake lines with no problems at all. I've even seen T's that use nothing but SS flex line the entire length of the brake line with no problems and a very firm brake pedal.

 

[blownt]

37 degree flare is for single flared SS tubing. I used to have SS and single flares with AN fittings. But during the last brake overhaul now I have store bought 3/16" brake tubing with 3/8" fittings and I double flared all cuts. Its EZ. Thought I'd get a firmer pedal going from 1/4" SS to 3/16" steel but can't tell much of a difference. I guess you could single flare steel to 37 degrees but don't know how safe it would be?

 

[Francis Blake]

Thanks guys, those are really good videos. I just came in from work and am going to put some of this info to work. will let you know how it goes

 

[Francis Blake]

Well I can't make it work but I know why the tool I have (speedway) is so crooked it will not start straight,the cone in the die that starts the flair has the size stamped into the top edge and it pushed metal into the cone so there is no way to hold it straight while it starts. I am just going to buy lines at the auto parts and get er done. thanks for all your help.

 

[Keeper]

Is the line slipping in the die? Are these double flares you are creating?

I have a cheapy flare kit, it took me a bit to get the hang of the thing at first, I was way over tightening the first flare or leaving too much line sticking up in the first place, causing all sorts of issues such as splitting, cracking and crooked flares.

I also learned that the only way to get mine to create straight flares was to not use the little wingnut on the tool, but to clamp it in a vise. That way the pressure was even across the tool allowing it to hold the line in place.