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Damaged Oil Pan

Discussion in 'Engines and Drivelines' started by Indycars, Jul 30, 2021.

  1. Indycars

    Indycars
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    I wanted to take this conversation to the correct forum, but below is a link to some more info.

    Short Notice - Cruise Lake Texoma

    Got the damaged pan off this yesterday, here is another look at it while it's off.

    FP03_OilPanDamage_02869.jpg

    I have a problem with the new pan, it hits the oil pump before it can go forward enough to
    align with the bolts holes in the block. I don't have the pickup tube installed, so it hitting the
    pump body. It needs to go forward another 1/8" to let the bolt holes align with the block.

    Note the difference in corners #1 and #2. Number 2 cuts the corner off more than corner #1.

    FP03_OilPumpInterference_02874.jpg

    You can see where the oil pump is putting marks on the pan wall when I try to push the
    pan forward.

    FP03_OilPumpInterference_02875.jpg
    .
     
  2. choppedtop

    choppedtop
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    What is the game plan now Rick? Different pan? Could you heat that area and dimple it, with a sand bag on the outside, enough without distorting the gasket area? Maybe to costly to try that and fail. IS there enough meat on the pump to take that much off? Sorry, just full of questions today.
     
  3. Indycars

    Indycars
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    I put a couple of studs in to help me guide the pan into place. Then I pulled it down with the
    bolts, not all but enough it had to be in place. As you can see it left this mark where it was
    gauging the pan inside.

    FP06_OilPumpBodyClearanceToPan_02890.jpg

    I can see and feel this bump in the oil pan.

    FP05_PumpCreatedDimple_02878.jpg


    Yes, grinding on the pump was the first thing I tried, but I can only take so much. It was
    not enough !

    FP05_OilPickupClearanceToPan_02888.jpg

    So next was the pan. I don't have metal working skills or tools and I can't wait since I going
    to Portland Maine in September ....... So I used a MAP torch and a ball peen hammer. It certainly
    shows, I just hope it's not going to be all that noticeable.

    FP07_CantonOilPanModification_02892.jpg
    FP07_CantonOilPanModification_02893.jpg
    It does clear now and no noticeable warping of the gasket surfaces. It was never going
    back, it had to fit one way or another !

    I love questions, my wife can walk all around it and never ask what I'm doing ..... please
    ask questions. To me it show interest!
    .
     
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  4. old round fart

    old round fart
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    Did It hurt you’re soul to take a hammer to a $400 oil pan?
     
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  5. fletcherson

    fletcherson
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    I gotta ask why it didn’t fit... is the pan defective? Is there a specific pump they recommend? I don’t see how any pump would fit without interference issues. That would really aggravate me after digging deep for quality parts, I expect them to fit. Your resolve is fine, no one but you will see it. BTW, you lucked out from the looks of that old pan. It really took a hit.
     
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  6. Indycars

    Indycars
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    Yes I have a damaged oil pan and soul now !!! LOL !
     
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  7. Indycars

    Indycars
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    My oil pump is the Melling 10552, which provides 10% over volume and standard pressures.
    It's about 3/4" longer than standard and that might have made the difference. But it's really
    typical when modifying engines, I almost never just bolt a component on without checking
    things.
     
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  8. PotvinGuy

    PotvinGuy
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    Indy, old chum, why the fancy pump and pan? Wouldn't a plain-vanilla pump and pan do the job?
     
  9. old round fart

    old round fart
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    With the horse power he’s making I don’t think he wanted to bet they “would do”. You know he kills flies with a 3 pound hammer don’t you?
     
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  10. Indycars

    Indycars
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    I made several oil system modifications to help oiling to the .....

    Timing chain
    Rear thrust face of the rear main bearing
    Distributor gear to camshaft gear

    With the mods I needed a pump with more volume to maintain good oil pressure. I have 20-25
    psi at idle and 50-60 psi at 5000 rpm with a 10w30 oil.

    This Road Race pan is much shorter at 7 inches which helps with the ground clearance. I will gain
    another 1-1/4 inch of clearance over the old damaged oil pan.

    Timing Chain Mod
    TimingChainOilMod_2417.jpg

    Main Bearing Mod
    ThrustBearingMod03_2109.jpg

    Distributor Gear to Cam Gear Mod
    OilingModForGear02_5225.jpg
    OilingModForGear01_5221.jpg
    .
     
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  11. fletcherson

    fletcherson
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    That explains it.
     
  12. Indycars

    Indycars
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    I'm going to back track alittle bit with my statement about the length of the pump. The pickup
    tube diameter is 3/4", but the pump is only 0.112 inches longer. That's based on the length of
    the gears in the pump, but should be essentially to correct.

    The volume is a direct function of the gear length if you hold the diameter constant.

    .112 / 1.2 = .093 or 9.3% more volume.

    NOTE: In the photo below is the pickup for the old pan, which means it would have to sit
    1.25 inches lower in the pan.

    GearDimensions_1736.jpg

    The pickup I'm using now is from Champ, they were the only company to make a pickup
    for my pump in a 7 inch oil pan. The pickup and oil pump are nearly at the same level, as you
    will see in the photos below.

    FP02_Champ_1028SB.jpg

    Below are the clearances from the pump body to the pan bottom. So the pickup is 3/8 to 1/2
    inch. I'm using the one piece gasket that is thicker than the old 4 piece gasket. ARP even
    sells longer bolts for the one piece gasket. PN: 134-1801
    PERFECT !!!

    https://www.summitracing.com/parts/arp-134-1801
    upload_2021-7-31_16-29-24.png

    FP05_OilPickupClearanceToPan_02880.jpg

    FP05_OilPickupClearanceToPan_02885.jpg
    .
     
  13. choppinczech

    choppinczech
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    What did you use to make that clearance blob? Pretty cool.

    I've done that with Bondo to check clearances under my deck lid.
     
  14. Indycars

    Indycars
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    The clearance blob was done with modeling clay. The same material NASA uses for their critical dimensions! I thought everyone knew that. LOL !!!
     
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  15. Spanky

    Spanky
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    I'm a little surprised that no one has mentioned the Slam Guard oil pan. I know several bucketheads who swear by them. :rolleyes:

    Slam guard.jpg Slam guard2.jpg
     
  16. Indycars

    Indycars
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    How deep are they ? I couldn't find that spec, even went to the Trans Dapt website.

    For myself, I would like better oil control and a higher capacity than 4-5 quarts.
     
  17. PotvinGuy

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  18. Indycars

    Indycars
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    I figured you have been taking too many afternoon naps, so I wanted to
    give something to keep you up !!! Drug Free !
     
  19. fletcherson

    fletcherson
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    What would stop someone from fabricating a similar shield for whatever pan they choose?
     
  20. Spanky

    Spanky
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    Nothing, and I know some who have.
     
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