Spirit vs. Total Performance

[Big_John]

I've been looking and have decided to go with a kit from either Spirit or Total Performance. I'm leaning toward the Spirit kit because it looks like its a better value (more bang for teh buck) but I'd like to hear some opinions.

As I see it, there are a few differences in design. The TP uses a Corvair steering box and the Spirit uses a Vega box. The drag link looks to hang a little low on the TP design, but I'm not sure about the Spirit. The steering box isn't included with the Spirit kit, but I've seen new ones on Ebay for $150. The steering box, column and a steering wheel are included in the TP kit.

Both seem to use similar frames, although the TP frame gets wider at the rear. Front ends seem similar too, the Spirit having a Panhard bar on the front axle.

The Spirit has a S-10 Chevy rear end that is complete with used axles and gears and the TP has an 8" Ford housing with axles/pumpkin being an additional $1500 .

The Spirit body has a fiberglass floor and a fiberglass insert/interior that stiffens the body and the TP has a plywood floor and you have to 'glass in some wood. The TP body has the pickup bed already attached.

I stopped at TP about eight or nine years ago while on a business trip. At the time, I was all set to buy a kit then, but life got in the way and that never happened. I did buy their assembly manual though. They seemed to have some good customer service going for them along with a long history and a time proven (nice words for old) design. I drove one of their cars back in the eighties and liked it.

They are about 4 hours away, I'm near Syracuse, so I could rent a truck to pickup a kit if I wanted. Being in Connecticut, I know their overhead is higher (wages, taxes etc.) and their price will be higher.

Spirit, being in Arkansas, will mean the kit will have to be shipped. I don't know a thing about them except for what I've read on the web. They seem to have a good design and their owner is all about having fun with your T-Bucket. I watched their video the other night about assembling the front end and while they need to work on their production, it was still informative and really not pushing the product as much as it was informational. That impressed me. I understand their assembly instructions are a little vague at best though.

There's a few things that I want in this car. First, I'm 6'2" tall, so I want to fit. I also want to sit down in the car, not on top of it as I've seen some buckets set up. I'm looking for a clean look, minimal chrome and a fifties "feel" about it. I'd love to use a flathead Ford for power, but I think a SBC with an auto trans is a better choice.

What does everybody think? Have I missed anything?

As I said, I'm leaning towards the Spirit kit. It seems a lot more complete for the money. I'm still on the fence though and want to go the right way before I pull the trigger on this.

Thanks in advance for the help! :welcome:

 

[Mike]

John, it looks as if you've researched both companies fairly well. And from that point, I think it comes down to the individual's personal choice.

It sounds as if Spirit's kit 'feels' better to you and I think there can be a lot to how we feel about a purchase. That may have played a large part in my decision to go with Total. I had been looking at their kits and dreaming for decades and when it was time to make a choice, there really was no choice.

For what it's worth, I come in a little over 6'2" myself and had a lot of questions about how well I was going to fit into a T. I had considered one of Total's Anniversary bodies, but Brian presented a pretty good case against it, for a tall fellow like myself. I drove out to visit Total (from central Indiana, mind you) and sat in a standard body with the seat insert, as opposed to the bench seat. It was surprisingly comfortable. Don't get me wrong, I'm not talking about, "Let's jump in the T and drive to California", type of comfortable, but the seat insert gets the driver down lower in the car and back a bit further.

I think you're doing the best you can do. You're looking at and weighing all the various options and from there, you just need to go with whatever feels right to you.

 

[thomas]

BigJohn

I purchased a Spirit kit am very pleased with the design. I payed a $1000.00 more to have them attach the bed, put an opening door and install the body insert. They glass in a 1/2" sheet of plywood in between the body and body insert. I upgraded to power brakes and 8.8 ford rearend. I'll have disc brakes both front and back. I also purchased the seat insert with my kit. You sit down and back with the insert. Check out my gallery. TP makes very good kits with great instructions and you could buy everything from TP complete your car. Which is a good thing. Buying through Spirit you do not get very good instructions, but I did not have that much of a problem putting it together. If you have any trouble, just ask tfeverfred, mike or rick, they will get you through any problems you may have. Or call Josh at spirit and he will send you pictures by e-mail. Spirit is more for the buck.

thomas

 

[Big_John]

Thanks for the input guys. I think its about time I gave Spirit a call and asked a bunch of questions.

Thomas, does the opening door make it any easier for the passenger to get in and out of the car? Is it worth that kind of $ to have them do the work?

I ask because my wife has a bad back and I would like to make this a pleasant experience for her. Me, I can fall in and out of cars as needed, but we gotta keep her happy.

 

[tfeverfred]

If I were you, I'd go for the door. Your lady will thank you. I talked to a guy at a show last year and he told me if I have a girlfriend or wife.... get the door. I have long legs and hopping or stepping in would be no problem for me. My girl has already told me she will deal with it not having a door. I hope I don't end up cutting that body in the future.

Like a lot of things, if you do it yourself and mess it up, you'll have a time fixing it or worse, you'll need another body. It depends on your experience with glass.

Also, if they do it and it isn't right, they would need to be held accountable. I hate working with fiberglass, I just don't have the time, space or patience for it, so I'll pay to have it done for me if needed..

 

[thomas]

BigJohn, It was well worth the money, also if you decide to go with Spirit get them to drill out the dash for your instruments and put the hole in fire wall for your steering colunm. They did not charge me for doing the two latter items. Ask for Josh,he's the owners son-in-law. Great guy to talk to. I'm 64 and my wife is 54 so having a door will make it so much easier getting in and out. Check out my gallery and check out the door.

thomas

 

[RPM]

I would go with Spirit. A great car, great price and most of all GREAT folks to deal with. What else could you want. I have dealt with Josh and Bob both and they are great people.

I can't say any thing about Total as I have not dealt with them.

 

[tfeverfred]

When I first made the decision to go with Total Performance, my choice was based on their years at building T Buckets and the great coverage they had recieved in the mags. Over the last year or so, I have learned that nothing can replace accumulated knowledge and that is what seperates Total from the other guys. I am a member of a few websites and it never fails that someone will have a problem or question about a non Total kit and that is when I realise that Total can't be beat. Heck, there are a few manufacturers that don't provide instructions or even have a manual to reference. I saw a photo of Totals showroom and there was a sign on the wall that stated: "Everything fits!". I can tell you first hand that it does.

Just about every build I read about said to mock everything up to make sure things fit, then take it apart for paint, etc. I chose to just go for it and I have had no problems. This is a testament to them having over 35 years in the business and working out the bugs. There were a few times I called Brian or Pete (well actually a few dozen times) and they were quick to tell me what I was doing wrong. In almost all the cases it was my fault for diviating from the instructions. At no time was the fault with their product. I have seen pics of other kits with decent welds. Totals were great welds. So much so that I didn't grind them down. Not because of laziness, but because they looked that great. If you wanted to, you could build a T Bucket from their catalog and not need to go anywhere else.

As of now, I have a running power plant installed and I am ready to mount the body (when I get it). I can see the light at the end of the tunnel. When I decide to build another and I know I will, Total Performance will get the call.

 

[Mike]

Over the last year or so, I have learned that nothing can replace accumulated knowledge and that is what seperates Total from the other guys.

Accumulated experience always helps.

My ex's son wanted me to 'teach' him how to work in the high performance industry. When I explained there was no way to teach him, he was amazed that he couldn't just find a source to learn everything it takes to work in in a job like mine. It's the school of hard-knocks and nothing else, believe me.

I've been doing this stuff a lot longer than Brian, but there's no way I could step into his position and be as effective as he, simply because of his accumulated knowledge and experience. He knows what will work and what doesn't work, because he's tried it and learned the hard way.

I'm sure people will develop in the same way at a place like Spirit or elsewhere, if they stick with it.

The problem with this industry (are you reading this Brian, you'll know this pain) is that you get people wanting to hire in with some pie-in-the-sky dreams about how romantic the industry is. You invest a few months in training that person to do their job well and the next day they are gone, looking for some other pie-in-the-sky dream.

The fact of the matter is this industry can be a lot of fun, but none of us are getting rich quick. If you love working with custom parts and/or high-performance parts, then you will get a lot of personal satisfaction. But had I spent all these years working in a factory, I would have been retired by now and with a lot more tucked away for a rainy day. Is the money more of a priority than some of the experiences I've had? Mmmmm, let me get back to you on that one.

 

[lanceks1]

I went with Spirit mainly because the FG work was so thick, and strong in the right places. For a turnkey type car, TP is the answer. But like myself, a lot of people like to make improvements to most everything they do. I wanted to massage most of my Spirit kit, and make it my own. I think the basic well built body parts, and frame, plus the very reasonable price was my answer. The Spirit guys did everything I expected to help me every step of the way. Telling me what they usually do, not ever forcing the issue. I love to drive the car, it handles like a very fast sports car. With nearly 100 year old suspension.
Without a door it's a chore to get in, but keeps me stretching, like I need to do. The finish, and workmanship is top notch, like I came to expect, after visiting their business in Mountain Home. I wondered about the shipping, but was impressed to see four pallets unloaded into my two car garage fairly easily. Make sure you have a place for a ton of cardboard though. All in all I think I have a WINNER!!

 

[Rick]

I went with Spirit mainly because the FG work was so thick, and strong in the right places. For a turnkey type car, TP is the answer. But like myself, a lot of people like to make improvements to most everything they do. I wanted to massage most of my Spirit kit, and make it my own. I think the basic well built body parts, and frame, plus the very reasonable price was my answer. The Spirit guys did everything I expected to help me every step of the way. Telling me what they usually do, not ever forcing the issue. I love to drive the car, it handles like a very fast sports car. With nearly 100 year old suspension.
Without a door it's a chore to get in, but keeps me stretching, like I need to do. The finish, and workmanship is top notch, like I came to expect, after visiting their business in Mountain Home. I wondered about the shipping, but was impressed to see four pallets unloaded into my two car garage fairly easily. Make sure you have a place for a ton of cardboard though. All in all I think I have a WINNER!!

Yep i would say you got a winner there.Good work.

 

[thomas]

You certainly do.

thomas

 

[lanceks1]

Thanks Guys, I am so glad this thread has a tag of "Chocolate Pudding".:lol: