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New to forum, first question on engine

J

jpm

New Member
After 20 years of antique tractor and gas engine restorations I have decided to build a t- bucket.
I have rebuilt countless lawn equipment engines, some v8s, I have worked mostly as a diesel heavy equipment mechanic. I also do part time work for one of the top 3 pulling tractor builders in the country.
I am very much old school and that is how I want to build my T. I have never rode in one so I know little of how they ride and handle, which brings up my first question.

I would like to build the T for my wife and I to cruise in, maybe take a 3 hour ride to the lake.
So, I want more of a driver and not so much as a pure speed demon, reasonable fuel mileage.
This is going to be a budget build between 5-6 K , I hope.

I would like to use a 225 slant six, love the way they look in a T. Reliable and buildable.
I am thinking of going stock, but, not sure if 140 hp is going to be enough to have some fun with or not.
I don't want a racer but don't want to get out run by street cars.
What do you guys think?
I could add a Clifford 3 weber system with a good cam and have the head worked over to get some more hp and hopefully not loose all mileage. Again, I have no experience with this so I don't know what the out come will be.
This will eat up a good bit of budget as well.

Now, for $200 my buddy will sell me a running 460 with c6. This helps the budget end and lots of power but how much fuel will it eat cruising to the lake?

I really don't want small block, would like to be different. I might run a straight 6 ford or old flat head straight 6 or straight eight if I cant locate a slant six.

What do you guys suggest for this type of build?
Thanks, jpm
 
Welcome! I think a slant 6 is a great choice and will give plenty of scoot to get these little cars down the road at a pretty good clip. There are a couple of things you mention that are a little concerning though. Like, a 3 hour trip to the lake... I haven't driven mine yet, but generally these cars aren't known for their comfort on long trips. I suppose one could be built for such, but some planning will be in order. I would definitely go with a stretched body for the extra leg room. Others may chime in with some more suggestions.

The other is the budget. There is a saying: Whatever you figure in time and money for your project, double it. Then you will be close. That certainly was accurate for me. My original budget was $5K for my project. I am now around $9K with about another $1K left to spend. It's nothing fancy and I am doing literally everything myself except building the drive shaft. It's all those little things that get you that you don't count on, like virtually every trip to the hardware store (and there are many) is $25, $40, $35, etc., etc. Trips to Autozone for thingamabobs and whatzits, $100 here, $75 there....you get the idea.

These cars can and have been built on a budget. You just need to have time to scour swap meets, have a lot of connections and have buddies with free or near free parts they need to get rid of.

Bob
 
Welcome to the site. When you decide to build, I always recommend you think of resale value. Look around at car shows, watch Ebay and some of the other on line sites. See what these cars are bringing. I am not saying don't build that slant six, they look cool, but will you be happy when it comes time to sell it?
 
First, welcome to the forum.

I second what Bob said about budget. 5-6K is going to be tight unless you shop VERY carefully and do all the work yourself. Not impossible, but difficult. These cars look super simple, but they still have nearly everything that a larger car has. Only the bodies tend to be cheaper, everything else costs just as much as if you were building any other car.

Plan your build carefully and build your plan. That's the only way to get by that cheap. Someone once said that it's the parts you buy, but don't use that make cars expensive.

I would stay away from the flatheads or any other antique type engine due to cost unless you know where a GOOD RUNNING engine is cheap. Nothing looks better IMO than a dressed flathead. but it will cost you 2-3 times as much as a typical small block to build. Then you have to either use a 60 year old driveline or adapt a later trans. Both are going to cost pretty good to do right.

If you have a source for the slant six and it's running, then get it if it's what you want. They're great engines. I had one in a car years ago and it pulled like a small V8. What Ron says is true though. These cars can be hard to sell if you ever want to move it on (unless you want to practically give it away). Unusual drivetrains or other features really narrow your field of potential buyers.

I would go with the 460/C6 that you have available IF it's running and in good shape. It fit's your budget and let's you move on to planning the car. You can put some very mild gearing in the back and I would think that it would get mid teens or better for mileage. That's assuming that it's tuned well. Ford made some 9" rearends with 2.45 gears ( I have one of those chunks somewhere in my shop). That would use the grunt of that big block and get the cruise RPM's way down for better mileage.

Look into Ron's stretched bodies. You'll like the extra room. His look good too. Proportions are good.

Other than that, put your money in a fairly standard chassis layout and build it safe. Then go have some fun.

Mike
 
Hotrod46 said:
First, welcome to the forum.

I second what Bob said about budget. 5-6K is going to be tight unless you shop VERY carefully and do all the work yourself. Not impossible, but difficult. These cars look super simple, but they still have nearly everything that a larger car has. Only the bodies tend to be cheaper, everything else costs just as much as if you were building any other car.

Plan your build carefully and build your plan. That's the only way to get by that cheap. Someone once said that it's the parts you buy, but don't use that make cars expensive.

I would stay away from the flatheads or any other antique type engine due to cost unless you know where a GOOD RUNNING engine is cheap. Nothing looks better IMO than a dressed flathead. but it will cost you 2-3 times as much as a typical small block to build. Then you have to either use a 60 year old driveline or adapt a later trans. Both are going to cost pretty good to do right.

If you have a source for the slant six and it's running, then get it if it's what you want. They're great engines. I had one in a car years ago and it pulled like a small V8. What Ron says is true though. These cars can be hard to sell if you ever want to move it on (unless you want to practically give it away). Unusual drivetrains or other features really narrow your field of potential buyers.

I would go with the 460/C6 that you have available IF it's running and in good shape. It fit's your budget and let's you move on to planning the car. You can put some very mild gearing in the back and I would think that it would get mid teens or better for mileage. That's assuming that it's tuned well. Ford made some 9" rearends with 2.45 gears ( I have one of those chunks somewhere in my shop). That would use the grunt of that big block and get the cruise RPM's way down for better mileage.

Look into Ron's stretched bodies. You'll like the extra room. His look good too. Proportions are good.

Other than that, put your money in a fairly standard chassis layout and build it safe. Then go have some fun.

Mike
Click to expand...



Thanks for your input guys,
I agree the 460 would save a lot of money, leaning in that direction
I have a friend who works in a fab shop, he can laser parts out for me at no cost most the time.
I have a mill and small lathe to help make parts
I will try to make as many parts as possible, like brackets, hairpins, headers, ect.
Hope to make the interior myself.
I can get a 8 or 9 inch for $100
There is one old junkyard near me that still has stuff from the 50s- 60s, hope to find front end parts there
So, hopefully I might stay near my budget.
And your right, it is almost always twice what you thought it would cost.
I heard a tractor puller once say, if you have to think about getting the check book out you shouldn't do it, I figured a T wouldn't be near that extreme. Pulling is verrrrrrrrrry $$$$$$$$$$$.
I found a slant six with trans in a dart, been sitting for a long time in junk yard. Guy wants $500 for both.
Add a rebuild and cost getting high, would be a cool build thou.
Thanks, again and I will keep you posted. JPM
 
Welcome to the site! I agree with the others that $5-6k will be tight, but in the US parts are soooo much cheaper!

As for the comfort, if you build it to be comfortable, it will be. I built mine with comfort in mind, I drove it 9 hours to Ohio last year without complaint (well other then the 6 hours of drizzle). I also agree about getting a stretched body.

As for the ride, well if you are used to tractors, you are close....lol.... They are a bit stiff, but you can play with spring rates and tire pressures, to get it a bit softer.
 
Thinking about resale is a two edged sword. When you build for resale you make decisions you may not be happy with. I would build what I want and if I decide to sell, take my lumps. You just may find someone that Wants a slant six and YOU are the only one for sale!
 
If you want the slant 6, go for it! I'm planning my build around an old 135hp GM V6....and yesterday it took a lot of will power to keep from buying an old Pontiac OHC 6. I love doing things different.

As far as horsepower goes, my Cougar is a round 17 to 1 pounds per horsepower...and is a decent highway cruiser. At 17 to 1 with a 140 hp horsepower engine, the weight of your car would be 2380 pounds...considerably more than you are likely to end up with.
 
I think the slant 6 looks pretty cool. especially with the 3 carb setup. I like the look of the track nose. That is what make these cars a bit different from each other. I am for building what you want. That way you are happy with then end result, driving it.
Lee
 
My vote is for the slant 6. If you discard the argument for the SBC based on resale value, the 6 has a lot more cool than the 460. The dress up and hot rod parts for the Ford are no bargain, so no advantage there. If you can make or get parts fabbed at a good deal, the slant 6 still wins. I built a track nosed T with an Olds engine because a guy gave me a running donor car. I could have bought a SBC for what the parts for the Olds cost. But the Olds had a sound like no other and I loved it. Well, you asked.
 
The 331 caddy motor is a iconic 'HotRod' motor....you can't build a cheap 426 Hemi and you can't build a cheap Nailhead. If there were millions of them floating around and cheap as dirt, then parts would be cheap. There were/are 10s of millions chevy 350's and 305's, thats why they're cheap. The same goes the Ford smallbock, or the 318 Dodge.

The 6 cylinders are really cool and have built alot of them. From the days where we cut up 6 heads to furnace braze a custom hybrid 300 cu.in., that motor we covered our heads and closed our eyes cause we knew it could come apart at any time, but that thing was totally awesome.are they V6's
Yes, you can build a really strong unique 6 cylinder. If your worried about money, buy the cam and the headers, and build your own intake....they are easy.
Just cut the runner a couple of inches from the head, braze on some tubing, connect all tubes with a slightly larger tube, mount yourself 3x2's, 2x2's, a big 4bbl. or 2 small 4bbls. Then you have a 'log' manifold....
At the swapmeets you can find all kinds of parts there for the I6's, theres some folks that are dis-illusioned trying to run them. They are not V-8s nor are they V6s. They sound unique and rev differently. Yes, you can build one that will run with the ProStock Crowd, but your gonna spend some coin doing it. Most I6's bottom ends can handle 6000 with no problems.

Theres alot of those 6's that'll run with the SBC's. Parts can be expensive, but you have to be smart. They can't rev like the SBC's, so you beat the streets with
Build your own intake or get one from a swapmeet....hell, you might even find one someone is selling to build another project....
 
Last edited:
To finish....
They can't rev like the SBC's (not in stock form anyway), so you beat the streets with midrange torque and rev's below 5000. But those things will run forever....they look great and sound cool as hell doing it....
 
I am going to go with a slant six, make my own exhaust and intake, cam, probably 390 2 barrel, head port polish.
I want to be able to drive it and still have enough scoot.
Bucket will have 8 inch stretch body, model A rear spring set up, rear gas tank, smoothy wheels, not sure what kind of exhaust yet. And I do want a nice interior, not sure what to do yet.
 
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