bucket of bolts build
- Thread starter no excuses
- Start date
no excuses
New Member
I will post cam card later today, it is a hydraulic roller that I am going to be running solid roller lifters on.
Indycars
Well-Known Member
That's a new twist on things ..... I'm sure the Dynomation doesn't have a setting for that so I will quarry the software developer for the best approach to this problem. Larry Atherton has always been quick to help with any questions I've had in the past. Will see what he has to say when I have all the data.
I had just opposite setup back in the early 70's when I had a 327 SBC in a 61 Vette that I bought from a friend with a 375 HP FI cam with hydraulic lifters. I traded him my 64 Nova and $400 for his Vette. Wow, that brought some OLD memories !!!
no excuses
New Member
valve lash will be tight, around .006"
no excuses
New Member
Indycars
Well-Known Member
OK, there is a slight disagreement in the cam card ......
If you want I can go with the ICA of 106°, this is the most common timing. Or you can go back Lunati for clarification and let me know ?
I'm using Dynomation 6.03.28 .
The Intake Centerline Angle (ICA) can be per the Cam Card at 106° and the Exhaust Centerline Angle (ECA) at 114° (Hand Written 112°) or it can be ICA=106° & ECA=114°
ICA = 108°, ECA = 112°
.
.
If you want I can go with the ICA of 106°, this is the most common timing. Or you can go back Lunati for clarification and let me know ?
I'm using Dynomation 6.03.28 .
The Intake Centerline Angle (ICA) can be per the Cam Card at 106° and the Exhaust Centerline Angle (ECA) at 114° (Hand Written 112°) or it can be ICA=106° & ECA=114°
ICA = 108°, ECA = 112°
.
This is good to know, I will use this info when talking with Larry Atherton.
.
Indycars
Well-Known Member
no excuses
New Member
I will get ahold of Lunati tomorrow
no excuses
New Member
Indycars
Well-Known Member
It's just NOT that complicated ..... [Intake Centerline (ICL) + Exhaust Centerline (ECL)] / 2 = Lobe Separation Angle (LSA)
if ICL = 106° and ECL = 112°,
then (106° ICL + 112° ECL) / 2 = 109° LSA
So for their numbers to be correct, one of the three numbers has to change.
I can go ahead and run the simulation using the 106° ICL and 114° ECL. I don't want to run this point into the ground just to make a point, we can just move along if you would like. But I will need those numbers I requested in my post #20.
if ICL = 106° and ECL = 112°,
then (106° ICL + 112° ECL) / 2 = 109° LSA
So for their numbers to be correct, one of the three numbers has to change.
I can go ahead and run the simulation using the 106° ICL and 114° ECL. I don't want to run this point into the ground just to make a point, we can just move along if you would like. But I will need those numbers I requested in my post #20.
Indycars
Well-Known Member
It's just NOT that complicated ..... [Intake Centerline (ICL) + Exhaust Centerline (ECL)] / 2 = Lobe Separation Angle (LSA)
if ICL = 106 and ECL = 112,
then (106° ICL + 112° ECL) / 2 = 109° LSA
So for their numbers to be correct, one of the three numbers has to change.
I can go ahead and run the simulation using the 106° ICL. I don't want to run this point into the ground just to make a point, we can just move along if you would like. But I will need those numbers from my post #
if ICL = 106 and ECL = 112,
then (106° ICL + 112° ECL) / 2 = 109° LSA
So for their numbers to be correct, one of the three numbers has to change.
I can go ahead and run the simulation using the 106° ICL. I don't want to run this point into the ground just to make a point, we can just move along if you would like. But I will need those numbers from my post #
no excuses
New Member
I think I got them all.
no excuses
New Member
Bore & Stroke:
4.030"x4"
Displacement: (cubic inches)
408ci
Rod Length:
6.2"
Heads Make/Model with flow numbers: Flow (CFM) at several lift points.
ProMaxx Project X
lift 100 200 300 400 500 600 700
Int 77 144 207 262 293 313 319
Ext 65 118 171 210 236 245 256
Combustion Chamber Size in CC’s:
56cc
Photo of Combustion Chamber or Select Chamber from Graphic Below:
Dome Volume: For a domed piston use a (-) negative number.
Valve Relief Volume: For a piston with valve reliefs or dish, use a (+) positive number.
20
Deck Clearance: (Piston to Block Surface)
.025
Head Gasket Bore:
4.100
Head Gasket Thickness:
.032
Valve Sizes Intake/Exhaust:
2.08"/1.6"
Intake Manifold Type: [Single or Dual Plane]
single plane
Manufacture/Model #:
Victor Jr #2981
Carburetor Size or EFI (CFM):
930cfm
Header Tube Diameter: Small, Medium, Large (1-5/8", 1-7/8", 2.0")
..... Tri-Y Headers, Stepped-Tube Headers
2" sprint style
Cam Specs: Need all 8 valve timing events (Intake & Exhaust) at seat-to-seat and at 0.050” plus lobe lift or valve lift OR post Cam Card
posted above
Rocker Ratio - Intake/Exhaust:
1.62 on both
Cam Installed per Cam Card, or Retarded or Advanced:
per card
Fuel Used: Gasoline (Octane ?), Methanol, Ethanol, E85 .....
93 octane pump gas
4.030"x4"
Displacement: (cubic inches)
408ci
Rod Length:
6.2"
Heads Make/Model with flow numbers: Flow (CFM) at several lift points.
ProMaxx Project X
lift 100 200 300 400 500 600 700
Int 77 144 207 262 293 313 319
Ext 65 118 171 210 236 245 256
Combustion Chamber Size in CC’s:
56cc
Photo of Combustion Chamber or Select Chamber from Graphic Below:
Dome Volume: For a domed piston use a (-) negative number.
Valve Relief Volume: For a piston with valve reliefs or dish, use a (+) positive number.
20
Deck Clearance: (Piston to Block Surface)
.025
Head Gasket Bore:
4.100
Head Gasket Thickness:
.032
Valve Sizes Intake/Exhaust:
2.08"/1.6"
Intake Manifold Type: [Single or Dual Plane]
single plane
Manufacture/Model #:
Victor Jr #2981
Carburetor Size or EFI (CFM):
930cfm
Header Tube Diameter: Small, Medium, Large (1-5/8", 1-7/8", 2.0")
..... Tri-Y Headers, Stepped-Tube Headers
2" sprint style
Cam Specs: Need all 8 valve timing events (Intake & Exhaust) at seat-to-seat and at 0.050” plus lobe lift or valve lift OR post Cam Card
posted above
Rocker Ratio - Intake/Exhaust:
1.62 on both
Cam Installed per Cam Card, or Retarded or Advanced:
per card
Fuel Used: Gasoline (Octane ?), Methanol, Ethanol, E85 .....
93 octane pump gas
Indycars
Well-Known Member
Sorry I didn't see your reply to the requested specs in your post #21 because I didn't click on "Click to Expand" at the bottom of your quote. If I had I would have noticed all your answers.
Since you are using a solid roller on a hydraulic roller camshaft with a lash of .006", the difference in lift between stock rockers of 1.6 and yours 1.62 essentially cancel out each other. Therefore I didn't adjust the lift to compensate. I will still run this by Larry Atherton on Monday, but until then the temporary results are below.
Your Dynamic Compression Ratio (DCR) could be raised from 7.54 (Engine #1) to 8.0 - 8.2. Unless you plan on traveling out of state where sometimes only 91 octane is available, then I would stay at 8.0.
To get alittle help, going to a thinner head gasket like a SCE copper at .021" (Engine #2). I know it says to use an o-ring, but I and several others have used it without the o-ring successfully many times. Just put two coats of the Permatex #80697 "Copper Spray A Gasket".
https://www.summitracing.com/search...kness-in/0-021-in?N=bore-in:4-135-in_4-060-in
Included is a PDF report with all the parameters, please review them to make sure they are ALL correct.
.
Since you are using a solid roller on a hydraulic roller camshaft with a lash of .006", the difference in lift between stock rockers of 1.6 and yours 1.62 essentially cancel out each other. Therefore I didn't adjust the lift to compensate. I will still run this by Larry Atherton on Monday, but until then the temporary results are below.
Your Dynamic Compression Ratio (DCR) could be raised from 7.54 (Engine #1) to 8.0 - 8.2. Unless you plan on traveling out of state where sometimes only 91 octane is available, then I would stay at 8.0.
To get alittle help, going to a thinner head gasket like a SCE copper at .021" (Engine #2). I know it says to use an o-ring, but I and several others have used it without the o-ring successfully many times. Just put two coats of the Permatex #80697 "Copper Spray A Gasket".
https://www.summitracing.com/search...kness-in/0-021-in?N=bore-in:4-135-in_4-060-in
Included is a PDF report with all the parameters, please review them to make sure they are ALL correct.
.
no excuses
New Member
Looks good, and thanks.. Another option to raise the DCR would be to deck the block a bit more. I will have to talk to my machinist about that.
It looks like it will be fun and wild when I hit the loud/scary peddle lol
I may have to build a roll cage for it and not just a roll bar
It looks like it will be fun and wild when I hit the loud/scary peddle lol
I may have to build a roll cage for it and not just a roll bar
old round fart
Well-Known Member
I’m not a fan of steel tube close to my head in a street car. A mild collision could have a bad ending. I was rereading your post to see if it was going to be a race car and noticed you had a tweaked front axle. Contact Nostalgia Sid in Oklahoma for advice. He is the man for dropped axles.
I may have to build a roll cage for it and not just a roll bar
They build 'em that way down under . . .
Indycars
Well-Known Member
You're Welcome !
If you're willing to spend a few more dollars then decking the block would certainly help. But if you have not bought your rotating assembly yet, then a different size piston dish would be an easy adjustment. Scat has a 15.8cc dish that would be perfect !
Bringing the quench clearance closer to .040" with the .021" head gasket will also help deter detonation.
https://www.summitracing.com/search...shaped-cup/piston-head-volume-cc/plus-15-80cc
Indycars
Well-Known Member
I found a blank Lunati cam card, so I transferred all the numbers over so I would
have a nice copy for my library of 126 cam cards now. Lunati does not make
their cam card available on their websites, so they are hard to find. Maybe this one
will make it to Google Images so others can find it.
Attached is also a PDF version.
Lunati Camshaft 20350518
have a nice copy for my library of 126 cam cards now. Lunati does not make
their cam card available on their websites, so they are hard to find. Maybe this one
will make it to Google Images so others can find it.
Attached is also a PDF version.
Lunati Camshaft 20350518
