Building a 383 stroker - Enter At Your Own Risk

[Indycars]

When checking the rods you need to keep the rod from twisting on the crankshaft. This can give a false reading sometimes. You also don't want the crank to rotate while you are torquing the rod bolts. So here is what I did.

To stop the rods from twisting during the torquing, I used two feeler gauges to take up any side play. Look closely, the feeler gauges are hard to see.



To stop the crank from turning while torquing, I used some fuel line without any bearing in the upper half (motor upside down). Then just snug the rear main bolts down good.



Go here for that Spreadsheet file I promised in my previous post.

https://tbucketeers.com/threads/component-check-build-sequence-tracking.16774/

 

[2old2fast]

12 packages of plasti-gage That oughta be enough for 12 engines !!! You only use about 3/4 " per bearing [at least that's all I use.
Good move on changing pistons , nobody knows how long we'll have 93 , maybe even 91
dave

 

[fletcherson]

Yes I just got a set of 12 plastigauges for .001 to .003 in the mail today. Already have the feeler gauges. I've never used the plastiguages before but I watched a video of a guy doing it and making adjustments to the bearings with a scotch pad. Not to sure about that, but Skip White has bearings for undersize and oversize and a half size too. I guess that's .0005 under or over. I just printed out the chart. So I will go down the list and see what I can do.

I never worried much with odd sized bearings myself. I just verify the dimensions and clearance, etc... I have seen engines with brass shims hand cut between the journal caps and other things that seemed strange to me. If it isn't right, I go back to the machine shop. I have recieved stuff mis marked from the machinist and the bearing manufacture. It does occasionally happen. Not often, thankfully.

 

[Bucketman]

12 packages of plasti-gage That oughta be enough for 12 engines !!! You only use about 3/4 " per bearing [at least that's all I use.
Good move on changing pistons , nobody knows how long we'll have 93 , maybe even 91
dave

LOL, didn't know how much plastic came with each gage. Better to have and not need, than to need and not have.

 

[Bucketman]

@Indycars, Wow that is quite a list. On the block it has "paint inside surfaces". Is that the valley under the intake? I've never painted that area. Some of these I will probably skip, like checking crankshaft for straightness. It better be straight, being brand new, and just balanced. I have everything brand new so I'm hoping it all fits together right. Cam bearings were replaced at the machine shop and the cam is brand new so checking journal clearance is something I have know idea how to do. If it slides in and doesn't wiggle up and down it will have to be good enough. I'm guessing torqueing 3 to 5 cycles means torqueing and backing off and torqueing again 3 to 5 times. I always did it twice but I can do it again if it's better.
I was just thinking, if I had a 350 block, using all the old stuff I have from my block I could build up a complete engine minus starter and alternator and carb. LOL

 

[Indycars]

Yes the list is very long, just do everything you can. You will be way ahead of most guys if you just check 1/2 of the items on the list.

I painted EVERY surface that was Not a machined surface. Therefore I painted under the timing cover, bottom end and valley. That's just me, it's not something that you need to do, it's just nice that nothing will rust while you are doing your assembly work and oil drains back to the pan a little faster. The block is a sand casting, therefore some of the sand is still there. Painting also seals the sand in place and keeps it from coming out into the oil supply.





Yes you are correct about backing them off each time you torque a bolt. Each time you torque a bolt the friction becomes less up to a point and it's more consistent also.

Read this very nice article by ARP about fasteners and torquing them.

http://arp-bolts.com/p/technical.php

You weren't the first nor will you be the last to think all those old parts are going to work and your budget won't change. hehehe

 

[Bucketman]

That's kind of what I was thinking when I bought stud kits for main rod caps, head bolts, and I went ahead and bought a kit with all stainless bolts for the rest of the engine. The studs are supposed to torque more accurately since the nut isn't twisting into the block. Just twisting against the stud. It was worth it to not have to clean the threads on the old bolts. LOL, like I said I have a complete 350 engine right down to the nuts n bolts.
I see the screens in the valley. Are you afraid they may get clogged somewhat over time and reduce the oil flow to your cam. Wouldn't be so bad for a roller cam but wouldn't be real good for flat tappets, or solid lifters. Just a thought.
I like the rubber hose trick to hold the crankshaft, I'm going to use it. That and some ARP fastener assembly lube. Does that work like loc-tite? Building Harleys requires loc-tite. I like to use it like somebody else payed for it.

 

[Indycars]

Just remember that studs are NOT torqued into the block, only the nut on the stud is torqued. Just follow ARP instructions.

No, I'm not worried for this TBucket. I will change oil way too often to have any crude build up on the screens. Did you notice the magnets in the valley corners? They are Neodymium magnets that can withstand temps of 302ºF without losing their magnetic properties. I also have several in the oil pan.

http://www.kjmagnetics.com/products.asp?cat=167

The ARP substance is a Moly type lubricant and NOT a thread locker. Maybe you need to read the ARP article again!

 

[Bucketman]

Yes studs in block are only finger tight. needs only be as deep as three times the diameter of the stud. I've built a few Harley Davidson engines and Harley Davison recommends Loc-tite on all bolts, torqued or not. They are right, the vibration in a Harley engine will loosen teeth. The only engine I ever saw built purposely out of balance.
I know, this isn't a Harley engine, so I will use the ARP lubricant. and they say 5-7 cycles when torqueing. I'm growing up. Got rid of the two wheeler and getting a car.

 

[Bucketman]

Was a nice two wheeler though.

 

[Indycars]

Damn that's a nice bike you had!!!

 

[Bucketman]

Thanks, I hope I can build a nice T-bucket with the money from it. It had 10.5:1 compression ratio and it ran good on 91 octane gas. This ones still for sale if you know anybody that wants one

 

[fletcherson]

Damn that's a nice bike you had!!!

Was a nice two wheeler though.View attachment 11051

nice bike! I haven't given up the two wheelers yet... I did get a bigger, smoother and hopefully easier on my bones ride...lol (valkyrie)

 

[Bucketman]

nice bike! I haven't given up the two wheelers yet... I did get a bigger, smoother and hopefully easier on my bones ride...lol (valkyrie)

I still have one even after I sell the red one. Bike rich n penny poor.

 

[fletcherson]

I still have one even after I sell the red one. Bike rich n penny poor.

I too have the too many toy illness! I get in moods and start liquidating, then I run across cool things. Next thing you know, the barn and shop are full, again... All I can say is it will be one hell of a yard sale when I check out! Lol...

 

[RPM]

Just remember that studs are NOT torqued into the block, only the nut on the stud is torqued. Just follow ARP instructions.

No, I'm not worried for this TBucket. I will change oil way too often to have any crude build up on the screens. Did you notice the magnets in the valley corners? They are Neodymium magnets that can withstand temps of 302ºF without losing their magnetic properties. I also have several in the oil pan.

http://www.kjmagnetics.com/products.asp?cat=167

The ARP substance is a Moly type lubricant and NOT a thread locker. Maybe you need to read the ARP article again!

You did give the main studs to the machine shop to install before they align honed the main bores? It will change the diameter of the bores! Same thing if you are using head studs.

 

[Screaming Metal]

Hahaha....IndyCars has it going on! Thats what I call building a motor! And they are correct, I can't tell you how many times I've seen perfectly good blocks screwed up by folks not installing the studs correctly. You can bust out into the waterjackets, bust out chunks of the block, or strip threads by not doing it correctly.
All blocks should have a torque plate on when boring and honing....its even more critical with the studs. I clean and chase all threads on all motors, its even more critical when running studs, so the threads are nice and clean so the locktite will hold things in place.
I have SS Shims cut to put on either side of the rods for torqueing things in place (I cut them so they look like big fat front end alignment shims)....I smooth any and all stress risers in a motor. Besides the screens in the valley to catch stuff. I also epoxy some magnets by them, too, also in the pan, to catch the giblets floating around in there.
Usually use a 3M metal conditioning pad and flapwheels to smooth the valley area, then paint for quick drainback.
If doing a motor like Indycars, I do the bronze screwin guide inserts....alot more work, but they don't wear out near as fast. On the presson guide seals, I use a exacto knife to nick the seal area to allow SOME lubrication. Theres alot of scuffing potential in the guide area if some lube isn't allowed in there. Lifters, rockers cut down on the oil flow up top to the rockers, what little gets up there is needed.

 

[Bucketman]

You did give the main studs to the machine shop to install before they align honed the main bores? It will change the diameter of the bores! Same thing if you are using head studs.

Didn't have them then. Still don't have them. Hope the rings take up the slack. Shouldn't change more than a couple of tenths at the most.

 

[Indycars]

Hahaha....IndyCars has it going on! Thats what I call building a motor!
That comment is greatly appreciated ...... thanks!

I do the bronze screwin guide inserts....alot more work, but they don't wear out near as fast. On the presson guide seals, I use a exacto knife to nick the seal area to allow SOME lubrication.
What's different about the screw in valve guides that make them last longer ???

I would like to see what you call a nick.

I guess you don't agree with the designed amount of oil flow in some situations.

They are OIL METERING devices ! They precisely meter the amount of oil passing by the seal and therefore into the the valve guide. Although the requirements for each engine differ according to the design parameters and operating conditions, the oil metering rate is generally within the range 0.1 - 1.0 mg per valve per hour.They are not installed to completely stop the oil, since it's required for valve stem to valve guide lubrication.

 

[Bucketman]

Makes sense Indycars, with no oil the friction would eventually start a fire. Like rubbing two sticks together. That's why clean oil is so important.
@ Screaming metal, Does nicking the seals cause the engine to smoke on start up? No smoke on start up means no leaky seals to me.