Header Design & Build

[RPM]

The flanges that let you put 2" pipes on a SBC:

The top flange goes on the motor. The bottom flange is welded to the pipes.
...and how they mate up:

Indy, I'm emailing with GP and the other guys here. Waiting for response to my ideas. I think Stainless headers sells parts and kits for DIYers, and GP does the actual welding if you want. I don't weld, except for J.B.Weld , so I guess GP will do mine...if they can! I want them to build the system on the car in their shop. But I get the feeling they aren't going to like that approach. I mean, what if I use their mock-up kit and the pipes don't look right on the car? Stay tuned.

That is what I used when I built these headers. 2" primary into a 4" collector, then into diesel mufflers 4" straight through.

 

[Spanky]

That is what I used when I built these headers. 2" primary into a 4" collector, then into diesel mufflers 4" straight through.

I'll bet that has a great sound.

 

[PotvinGuy]

Ron, are your pipes SS or chrome or ?
I'm thinking of something a little more kinky:

 

[old round fart]

Ooooh! Those would look good on my long car! Are those commercially available?

 

[RPM]

Ron, are your pipes SS or chrome or ?
I'm thinking of something a little more kinky:

Just mild steel then ceramic coated it all.

 

[PotvinGuy]

Ooooh! Those would look good on my long car! Are those commercially available?

 

[PotvinGuy]

Not that I know, ORF. I got that pic from a mag a while back.

 

[old round fart]

Rats! Just my luck. Thanks

 

[Indycars]

Indy, I'm emailing with GP and the other guys here. Waiting for response to my ideas. I think Stainless headers sells parts and kits for DIYers, and GP does the actual welding if you want. I don't weld, except for J.B.Weld , so I guess GP will do mine...if they can! I want them to build the system on the car in their shop. But I get the feeling they aren't going to like that approach. I mean, what if I use their mock-up kit and the pipes don't look right on the car? Stay tuned.

Who are you talking with at GPH, I have always dealt with Zach so far?

If you designed them, why would they not look right??? Yea, they use a 2" or 3" radius
when they build the actual header. Do you think they could look that much different
from the mockup?

What gives you the feeling they would not want to build them on the car in their shop,
seems there would be alot less problems that way?

Are you going to use V Band Clamps or Marman Clamps ??

Get a MIG welder, anyone can do that with a little practice ! Yes that means even you!

 

[Indycars]

but in the end it will be you that does the work. Advice was given to me in '85 by a old WO5 Huey pilot. I have always remembered and used that advice since that day. Just something to keep in mind. Good luck with your project.

Done by me, to please me!

Thanks for the good wishes!

 

[Indycars]

Hey Rick, I want a set of custom stainless headers to if it'll make my car sound this good.

I could design some to do that for the right price !!! But I might have to move out of
state with no forwarding address!

Does it have to do all that surging at idle?

 

[Spanky]

Does it have to do all that surging at idle?

That's what blower motors do, at least on street (?) cars, and many think that's cool. Fuel dragsters don't do that, however . . . hm.m.m.m.m.?

 

[409T]

Blower surge comes from lack of boost referencing to the carbs. Typically Holley's, Quick Fuel's etc. have no boost referencing out of the box, external lines have to be added to eliminate the blower surge. Some people like it, not my cup of tea. I have Edelbrock 1405's with a few minor modifications and they do not cause any surge with my 671 blower at about 800-900 rpm idle.

 

[Indycars]

I think I remember Screaming Metal saying that they were not tuned right if they did
that .... or something to that effect.

Then I see 409T responded while I was creating my response ... thanks !

Seems that would be very annoying when you are sitting at the stoplight with an automatic
transmission. Also I would hate to think that someone in know is rolling there eyes when
they see me at the stoplight. That's just simply embarrassing!!!

 

[RPM]

My blower motor didn't have that surge to it.

 

[old round fart]

I think the throttle valves are to closed. When the vacuum drops the power valve give the motor a shot of fuel and airflow opens throttle. Mine didn’t do it either. He’s idling to slow I think.

 

[Indycars]

Got the GHP mockup kit, arrived last Thursday November 7th. It includes what you see
below. It has extra pieces at my request, so I would have the option to design a Tri-Y design
"4 into 2 into 1" (4-2-1) ... OR ... the traditional "4 into 1" (4-1). Therefore you will notice
that it has six 2-1 collectors and two 4-1 collectors.



I needed to document the frame angle as it sits on the safety stands so I can make my
last collector parallel at 3.1°.




John (ORF) came over to see what's going on, he is always supporting me with my projects .... thanks John!

John actually did what you see in the first pic. You will notice I'm trying to keep the last
collector inside the rear hair pins, so the wife does not get burnt again. It certainly is adding
another level of complexity as I try to get the primary tubes around the steering.



Take a look at those 2-1 collectors, they are what's called a Merger Collector. They don't
abruptly end in a bigger tube like the traditional 4-1 collector, they merge at an angle or
around of 15°.







OK if numbers give you a headache, this is where you stop reading !!! Do NOT go past this point !!!

Now try to configure those primary tubes while also meeting the dimension below. First graphic
is the inputs and the 2nd graphic is the dimensions that Pipemax 4.5 is giving me. Oh, btw you
will notice that I paired cylinder 1-3 and 5-7, that's not the optimal union for a SBC firing order
of 1-8-4-3-6-5-7-2. John and I both agreed it would be nearly impossible to pair cylinders 1-7
and 3-5, oh what a headache these requirements are turning out to be !!! I have posed this question
on the Pipemax forum to see what Larry Meaux says about how important cylinder pairing is.



I've highlighted the important dimensions that I'm trying to meet. I'm not entirely sure I
understand them all, so I've also posted a question on the Pipemax forum to clarify.

 

[old round fart]

Looking good. How close are the runner lengths? Did you look at the 1-3 pipe going to the inside at collector? I’ll try to get over tomorrow.

 

[fletcherson]

Wow! I applaud your effort. I would drive myself crazy with all of the possible variations. Take pictures and detailed notes and compare the pros and cons of each design. Have you (I presume so) calculated the variables from the scavenging perspective, etc of the various configurations? Btw, nice to have a buddy come share energy with you. We called it moral support, lol... if nothing else, hand me a beer! Miss those days a lot.

 

[Indycars]

Looking good. How close are the runner lengths? Did you look at the 1-3 pipe going to the inside at collector? I’ll try to get over tomorrow.

The numbers in RED are the lengths of each section. The first section of the primary
should be 19.1" - 20.3" per the report from Pipemax 4.5 above. The same for the 2nd
section for a total length of 38.2" - 40.6".