Kaaso
Member
Thanks Bruce. That thread helped me a tremendous amount.
sitting low
- Thread starter mikeyboist
- Start date
Thanks Bruce. That thread helped me a tremendous amount.
deckofficer
Banned
Hey T-odd,
On Don's T, the exhaust comes in two flavors. In the 1st picture is he using a baffle insert or a restrictor plate for pumping up the low end? Last time I saw Ted he told me if I wanted a stronger low end and didn't care about losing some top end, narrow down the exhaust or use a restrictor plate. Can you shed some light on Don's exhaust? I like learning stuff and with my exhaust going through a manifold and not headers, plus tail pipe to the diff, it isn't a good canidate for high strung engines that need to breath.
Bob
On Don's T, the exhaust comes in two flavors. In the 1st picture is he using a baffle insert or a restrictor plate for pumping up the low end? Last time I saw Ted he told me if I wanted a stronger low end and didn't care about losing some top end, narrow down the exhaust or use a restrictor plate. Can you shed some light on Don's exhaust? I like learning stuff and with my exhaust going through a manifold and not headers, plus tail pipe to the diff, it isn't a good canidate for high strung engines that need to breath.
Bob
Lee_in_KC
Active Member
T-odd probably knows more details, but IIRC, Stitch sold the car to someone in Arizona who got rear-ended in it pretty badly. Car was totalled. I don't recall if or how bad the driver was hurt. Pix of the car after the wreck were posted somewhere, maybe NTBA. I remember seeing them. BAD.
T-Odd
Member
deckofficer, I believe Don's bucket still uses the restrictor, he just added the turnout after the image to which you referred was taken in order to complete the look he was after - and I must say again it is fairly close to perfect.
In my experience and understanding from what I've read a few times in some Car Craft/ Hot Rod/ Street Rodder/ etc. dyno tests for headers, smaller header pipes will curve the power down to make torque peak at lower RPMs at the expense of high-end HP.
Free flowing larger header diameters should allow a good engine to breathe, and make high-rpm horsepower at the expense of low end torque.
I think Don's baffle was first designed as a muffler, not sure how much the torque/hp influenced the design.
Same type of design was used on my friend Tim's old bucket. I'm trying to dig up a before photo. Here's the after version with the exhaust routed under the car.
In my experience and understanding from what I've read a few times in some Car Craft/ Hot Rod/ Street Rodder/ etc. dyno tests for headers, smaller header pipes will curve the power down to make torque peak at lower RPMs at the expense of high-end HP.
Free flowing larger header diameters should allow a good engine to breathe, and make high-rpm horsepower at the expense of low end torque.
I think Don's baffle was first designed as a muffler, not sure how much the torque/hp influenced the design.
Same type of design was used on my friend Tim's old bucket. I'm trying to dig up a before photo. Here's the after version with the exhaust routed under the car.
leg show T
Banned
T-odd, I went to your mailbox, it's full, so, I know this is off subject. I worked with guys from Arkansas, Tennessee, and Missouri.
These guys became best friends of mine. In school, I also majored in history-- studied the Civil War. I know every battlefield
and went back to the southern states and visited as many sites as I could. Sacred places, for sure. I, for sure, don't consider
myself better than anybody else. I worked 7 days a week most all my life. Anyway, I saw you and your dad in the T-Bucket. What a
great photograph! Touching base on the cars a little bit. My car's a 1915, not practical, really, way too small. And most of my life, I
weighted a couple hundred pounds with a size 11 boot and took most of the front seat myself. Two people in the car pretty much
pushing the other person out. I think what happened on the thread is mainly a generation thing. I lived in the '60's when the war
was going on. I don't know, all that stuff seems to stay in your head. My dad had 5 brothers, 2 fought in World War II. My Uncle
Fran was a fighter pilot, and my Uncle Bill was in Artillery. These guys were pretty much no nonsense. That's how I was raised.
With the guys on the Forum that are in their 40's and 50's, it just becomes a generation gap with different understandings
and beliefs. I don't think of my car or myself being the best of anything, I just try to take one day at a time. My point being, that was how I
was raised, you never stop fighting, you never give up. If you die, you die, but you don't give up. That's what I love about the south. Why
do you think my first name is Robert? Hope there's no hard feelings. No need to reply. Bob Nunes
These guys became best friends of mine. In school, I also majored in history-- studied the Civil War. I know every battlefield
and went back to the southern states and visited as many sites as I could. Sacred places, for sure. I, for sure, don't consider
myself better than anybody else. I worked 7 days a week most all my life. Anyway, I saw you and your dad in the T-Bucket. What a
great photograph! Touching base on the cars a little bit. My car's a 1915, not practical, really, way too small. And most of my life, I
weighted a couple hundred pounds with a size 11 boot and took most of the front seat myself. Two people in the car pretty much
pushing the other person out. I think what happened on the thread is mainly a generation thing. I lived in the '60's when the war
was going on. I don't know, all that stuff seems to stay in your head. My dad had 5 brothers, 2 fought in World War II. My Uncle
Fran was a fighter pilot, and my Uncle Bill was in Artillery. These guys were pretty much no nonsense. That's how I was raised.
With the guys on the Forum that are in their 40's and 50's, it just becomes a generation gap with different understandings
and beliefs. I don't think of my car or myself being the best of anything, I just try to take one day at a time. My point being, that was how I
was raised, you never stop fighting, you never give up. If you die, you die, but you don't give up. That's what I love about the south. Why
do you think my first name is Robert? Hope there's no hard feelings. No need to reply. Bob Nunes
T-Odd
Member
Hey Bob, if you ever met me face to face you'd know that my father did his best to raise me right. I prefer to try to act as gentlemanly as possible yet still attempt to have as much as lawfully allowed.
I hold absolutely no ill feelings toward you or any other member. Heck, I'd bet at least a couple of my very best friends started out on halfway questionable terms to someone watching us if it was some kind of reality show.
Maybe sometime down the road we'll meet, share some stories, grab a bite or have a drink. I don't hold a grudge. In the meantime, we'll move on (and I'm not saying that this never happened, just trying to clarify that there's absolutely no problem on my end and we really don't have to spend any more of anyone's valuable time and Admin's website with any of this Orange County Choppers soap opera drama stuff, it's over) and get back to the subject of the thread.
Low buckets have been built before and have been built to drive. It can be done as long as you know what you're doing and how best achieve the look you're after whilst maintaining SAFETY. Just takes a tad bit more planning than just adding a dropped axle and changing the mounts on the rear suspension.
Really doesn't take too much more once you get the game plan together, but you really do need to plan properly. Think of it as building a (full size) model car out of a bunch of different models. Did that on 1/24 scale a lot when I was younger. Plastic's very easy to work with. Even went so far as to use thread for spark plug wires and tried to make sure I got the firing order correct. Haven't built a model car in a long time though. I digress... sorry about the diversion.
The old saying "measure twice, cut once" is kinda how you need to think. Mock up you might do a bunch of measuring and cutting though.
It helps if you have all the MAJOR pieces before you build a frame. Sure cuts down on the "let's start all over" factor.
I've used wood as frame mockup before, but my friend Johnny's idea of making some C Channel out of sheet metal worked so good that I highly recommend going that route... can't believe I never thought of it. So dang obvious that it would work better.
Somebody here made some plans for a homemade metal brake that is awesome. Build a brake, and grab some sheet metal. You can tack that sheet metal C Channel with a little 110 Mig. It should be strong enough to support the average fiberglass T Bucket body (without wood reinforcement, etc).
Build a complete front end hub to hub and mount the rims and tires you want (or something the same size). You can install the radius rods so that during the mockup you can tack the RR mounts in place on the mockup frame and almost make a rolling chassis. Don't know if I'd trust those tack welds that much though.
Find a rear end and mount the rims and tires you plan to use (or something the exact same size). Helps to have an old engine and trans that you can hang in place from a cherry picker or even sitting on blocks if you have to - got a gutted sbc and gutted trans for this purpose, mounted on a roller cart that sits at a nice adequate clearance for the average bucket. When you sit that bucket body on the mockup frame it will give you a pretty good idea of how much interior room you'll have (or rather WON'T have in most cases).
Once you get your measurements "finalized" you can start building the real frame. Should go together smoothly if you did your preparation during the mockup stage.
Now, get to building LOL. AND TAKE PICS, we really like pics.
I hold absolutely no ill feelings toward you or any other member. Heck, I'd bet at least a couple of my very best friends started out on halfway questionable terms to someone watching us if it was some kind of reality show.
Maybe sometime down the road we'll meet, share some stories, grab a bite or have a drink. I don't hold a grudge. In the meantime, we'll move on (and I'm not saying that this never happened, just trying to clarify that there's absolutely no problem on my end and we really don't have to spend any more of anyone's valuable time and Admin's website with any of this Orange County Choppers soap opera drama stuff, it's over) and get back to the subject of the thread.
Low buckets have been built before and have been built to drive. It can be done as long as you know what you're doing and how best achieve the look you're after whilst maintaining SAFETY. Just takes a tad bit more planning than just adding a dropped axle and changing the mounts on the rear suspension.
Really doesn't take too much more once you get the game plan together, but you really do need to plan properly. Think of it as building a (full size) model car out of a bunch of different models. Did that on 1/24 scale a lot when I was younger. Plastic's very easy to work with. Even went so far as to use thread for spark plug wires and tried to make sure I got the firing order correct. Haven't built a model car in a long time though. I digress... sorry about the diversion.
The old saying "measure twice, cut once" is kinda how you need to think. Mock up you might do a bunch of measuring and cutting though.
It helps if you have all the MAJOR pieces before you build a frame. Sure cuts down on the "let's start all over" factor.
I've used wood as frame mockup before, but my friend Johnny's idea of making some C Channel out of sheet metal worked so good that I highly recommend going that route... can't believe I never thought of it. So dang obvious that it would work better.
Somebody here made some plans for a homemade metal brake that is awesome. Build a brake, and grab some sheet metal. You can tack that sheet metal C Channel with a little 110 Mig. It should be strong enough to support the average fiberglass T Bucket body (without wood reinforcement, etc).
Build a complete front end hub to hub and mount the rims and tires you want (or something the same size). You can install the radius rods so that during the mockup you can tack the RR mounts in place on the mockup frame and almost make a rolling chassis. Don't know if I'd trust those tack welds that much though.
Find a rear end and mount the rims and tires you plan to use (or something the exact same size). Helps to have an old engine and trans that you can hang in place from a cherry picker or even sitting on blocks if you have to - got a gutted sbc and gutted trans for this purpose, mounted on a roller cart that sits at a nice adequate clearance for the average bucket. When you sit that bucket body on the mockup frame it will give you a pretty good idea of how much interior room you'll have (or rather WON'T have in most cases).
Once you get your measurements "finalized" you can start building the real frame. Should go together smoothly if you did your preparation during the mockup stage.
Now, get to building LOL. AND TAKE PICS, we really like pics.
leg show T
Banned
T-Odd-
Here is a car from a friend of mine from the 60's. A pie section was taken out of the frame rails and then bend back slightly. VERY cool look! Anyway... Time for me to get back to work.
Bob
Here is a car from a friend of mine from the 60's. A pie section was taken out of the frame rails and then bend back slightly. VERY cool look! Anyway... Time for me to get back to work.
Bob
Mike
Well-Known Member
I want to thank Bob and Todd for shaking hands after this stramash. :thumb:
I'm not pointing fingers, nor am I naming any names, but a member threw in the towel over this thread and decided to leave the site. I've e-mailed this member to show him a couple members of this site have managed to reach common ground. I hope this will convince the individual to come back and participate here again.
I just want everyone to see the need to take a few deep breaths before submitting a strongly-worded post. A simple post can kick off into something bigger that causes the site to suffer.
Carry on gentlemen, I'm going back to working on some sites.
I'm not pointing fingers, nor am I naming any names, but a member threw in the towel over this thread and decided to leave the site. I've e-mailed this member to show him a couple members of this site have managed to reach common ground. I hope this will convince the individual to come back and participate here again.
I just want everyone to see the need to take a few deep breaths before submitting a strongly-worded post. A simple post can kick off into something bigger that causes the site to suffer.
Carry on gentlemen, I'm going back to working on some sites.
T-Odd
Member
Mike, no need to thank... speaking for myself that is, as I always try to find a common ground with most everyone I ever meet. Just the type of guy I am I suppose.
Sure hope the missing will re-appear as I am fascinated by his build.
Used a couple of his pics to "shop" up the VW powered four-seater superlow stretch I am in the process of gathering parts to build.
Sure hope the missing will re-appear as I am fascinated by his build.
Used a couple of his pics to "shop" up the VW powered four-seater superlow stretch I am in the process of gathering parts to build.
leg show T
Banned
Elchstedt-
Leg Show T coolest Cat that ever lived!
My car from the floor to the top of the door is 19 inches... sitting low!!
~Bob
Leg Show T coolest Cat that ever lived!
My car from the floor to the top of the door is 19 inches... sitting low!!
~Bob
deckofficer
Banned
When this thread was started, I went through all my pictures of the Track T and discovered I had none that showed ground clearance (or lack of). Took some pictures today just for this thread. The frame is not that low, but how low the drivetrain was set in the frame is really low. The oil pan is only 3" off the road, and is only a 6" deep pan. The last picture is just a short blast to 90 mph, as the new engine now has almost 500 miles on it. Oil change time.
Attachments
deckofficer
Banned
Hey Ted,
The Track T has a differant personality with the little torquey 383 than the last time you rode in it. 25 mph in 4th at 900 rpms then after the speed limit rises, just roll on some throttle with no need to downshift. If you think 90 mph at 3500 rpms is geared high, I wish for a .73 overdrive so 90mph would be 2550 rpms. The old circle track race engine had a teflon "girdle" on the oil pan, this pan that was just built for the 383 has at this time, no skid plate protection, will be a winter time project.
Ironhead,
(2) 985 cid engines will gulp more fuel than (2) 540 cid engines, so the Track-T is miserly on fuel by comparision and not much slower.
Bob
The Track T has a differant personality with the little torquey 383 than the last time you rode in it. 25 mph in 4th at 900 rpms then after the speed limit rises, just roll on some throttle with no need to downshift. If you think 90 mph at 3500 rpms is geared high, I wish for a .73 overdrive so 90mph would be 2550 rpms. The old circle track race engine had a teflon "girdle" on the oil pan, this pan that was just built for the 383 has at this time, no skid plate protection, will be a winter time project.
Ironhead,
(2) 985 cid engines will gulp more fuel than (2) 540 cid engines, so the Track-T is miserly on fuel by comparision and not much slower.
Bob
one finger john
Active Member
I believe that is an air plane community (?) Street signage is subject to impact from low wings, going to or coming from the strip.
Bob, where is this community and what is its history? Also explain the teflon girdle on the old oil pan.
John
deckofficer
Banned
John is correct, airplane community called Cameron Park, off of Hwy 50 between Sacramento and Lake Tahoe. I'm not sure it was teflon, but was a hard, low friction type plastic.
Gerry
Well-Known Member
deckofficer
Banned
Gerry,
Again let me say how good it is to have our "UK connection" back on the forum. There WAS someone on the forum that made me a little uncomfortable to post due to his total disdain of anyone that did not build their ride. On to the girdle, yes it does work as it only covers the front, back and sides of the bottom of the oil pan. When a road obstruction makes contact with the girdle it transmit that upward loading onto the verticle sides of the oil pan where it can handle some compression loading. The material used has a very low friction coefincient (sp) and does not hang up on it. It is also tapered from the front. Wish I still had it to show you pictures.
Bob
Again let me say how good it is to have our "UK connection" back on the forum. There WAS someone on the forum that made me a little uncomfortable to post due to his total disdain of anyone that did not build their ride. On to the girdle, yes it does work as it only covers the front, back and sides of the bottom of the oil pan. When a road obstruction makes contact with the girdle it transmit that upward loading onto the verticle sides of the oil pan where it can handle some compression loading. The material used has a very low friction coefincient (sp) and does not hang up on it. It is also tapered from the front. Wish I still had it to show you pictures.
Bob
one finger john
Active Member
Sounds more like a teflon diaper or an athletic cup (being serious here). Perhaps something from the off-road people or dirt track racers? No names on it? Think lots of T bucket owners would go for something like that.
John
John
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