Brian's Bucket Build

[PotvinGuy]

Bad memories. My first bucket had Hallcraft wires, motorcycles tires and no brakes on front. Just drums on the rear. It would stop, but I needed to plan ahead.

 

[Hackerbilt]

Bad memories. My first bucket had Hallcraft wires, motorcycles tires and no brakes on front. Just drums on the rear. It would stop, but I needed to plan ahead.

Mine had no fronts when previous owner bought it. He wasn't long changing it over to 4 wheel brakes! LoL
Told me it was pretty scary sliding thru the red light with both rear wheels locked up!!!

 

[PotvinGuy]

Told me it was pretty scary sliding thru the red light with both rear wheels locked up!!!

Thank you so much for that terrifying memory Please, God, I'll change my ways!!

 

[choppedtop]

I have always been taught that fronts brakes were for stopping and rear brakes were for control. I know that is true for motorcycles.

 

[fletcherson]

I have always been taught that fronts brakes were for stopping and rear brakes were for control. I know that is true for motorcycles.

I agree, but I like balance. In a curve, especially on a bike, I dont want to transfer the weight or momentum by over using the front brakes, nose dive, etc...

 

[Neshkoro]

When I was a kid I had a bicycle with just front brakes. Took a trip over
the handle bars a couple of times. NO fun.

 

[skinny mike]

Am anxious to see the outcome/fix. Very intriguing issue.

 

[BrianD]

To balance the brakes I used a FRONT mounted adjustable proportioning valve to slightly limit front brake effectiveness. IIRC, I only had to turn it in 1/2 a turn from wide open and that was enough to let the rear do their part.

I don't think installing a proportioning valve to the front brakes will help me. I already don't feel that the front brakes are stopping the car properly and installing a restriction to the front calipers is only going to make things worse. Am I correct in assuming that I should be able to stop this thing with what I would call normal brake pedal pressure and all 4 wheels should be locking up during hard braking? I know that it is said that you don't need power brakes on a bucket, but should this be an option for me? Also what about changing to rear disc brakes? It's been raining alot here in NJ lately an haven't had it out, maybe by the weekend.

 

[T-Test]

Have you checked the M/C to see if it has factory residuals are installed? Don't trust someone saying there arn't any because you won't know until you look.

 

[Hackerbilt]

I don't think installing a proportioning valve to the front brakes will help me. I already don't feel that the front brakes are stopping the car properly and installing a restriction to the front calipers is only going to make things worse. Am I correct in assuming that I should be able to stop this thing with what I would call normal brake pedal pressure and all 4 wheels should be locking up during hard braking? I know that it is said that you don't need power brakes on a bucket, but should this be an option for me? Also what about changing to rear disc brakes? It's been raining alot here in NJ lately an haven't had it out, maybe by the weekend.

I thought your front brakes were good now? (Post 72)
All our cars are a little different.
Mine had the same brakes as you and in my case the fronts were fine but the rear were just along for the ride.
Very easy to slide the fronts on poor surfaces like grass or dirt. The rears didn't do anything.
Put the APV on the front and with a very slight adjustment things balanced right out.

If you still have problems like very high pedal pressure you need to get that fixed first for sure!

I think once you get the pedal pressure into the range you like you may still need to use an APV...but you gotta have good FRONT brakes before that becomes sensible.

 

[BrianD]

The front are much better than before with the small m/c. However the rears still suck. Today I installed an adjustable proportioning vale in the front brake circuit, if it ever stops raining here I'll see if it helps.

 

[HenrysT]

What rear end do you have? Can you get a larger brake for it? Bigger drums or disc

 

[RPM]

Are we sure, we have the rear brakes assembled correctly? We had sold I don't know how many of these, and never heard of a problem like this.

 

[BrianD]

Ron, that's what I first thought. Since I haven't worked with drum brakes in some time, I took photo's before I took them apart so I would have a reference when I put them back together. I have since rechecked that I have everything installed correctly. All the rear brake parts are new. I have read several post from previous years of people having the exact same problem I'm having and installing an APV in the front brake circuit resolved their problem. So, that's what I did, hopefully it will dry up around hear for a little bit and I'll see if it helped.

 

[old round fart]

You noticed the rear shoes are longer than the front , right?

 

[BrianD]

Yes,the larger shoe's are towards the rear.

 

[Hackerbilt]

What rear end do you have? Can you get a larger brake for it? Bigger drums or disc

As I mentioned in a previous post, that is definately the ultimate cure.
You are increasing rear brake force to match the original setup that GM used with those Chevelle style front brakes. Unfortunately for me they were impossible to find locally.
The APV was a reasonable second choice.

BrianD...keep in mind, you won't need much adjustment from wide open. I tested it in just 1/4 turn increments so as not to lose too much response from the fronts.
Do your testing in a parking lot or something.
ALWAYS be safe.

 

[BrianD]

Well I got out for a ride today and still no good. I jacked the rear of the car up and ran it in gear and I was unable to stop the wheels. The rear brakes are barely operating. I pulled the drums and stepped on the brakes and both wheel cylinders were expanding. I double and triple checked that the shoes and springs were installed correctly. Something aint right. Like I said all of the brake components were new when installed,bought from rock auto. So, I said the heck with it and went to advance auto and bought all new stuff. Tomorrow's another day, glad I'm retired.

 

[Island Girl]

Just kind of a shot in the dark here, . . .

But if you have self adjusters, are they on the right sides so the pawl expands the adjuster?

 

[AusBucket]

G'Day Brian,
Sounds like there might be air in the rear line somewhere, is the pedal spongy at all? Sometimes I've had it right at the M/Cylinder outlet because I didn't bench bleed it, but it can be done on the car with care..
Regards,